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Today could be the end of the line for Ryan Dempster as a member of the Chicago Cubs, but no report has yet suggested that he didn’t make the team flight to St. Louis today. Dempster is scheduled to start tonight at 7:15pm CT, so, if he’s to be bumped (assuming a trade isn’t announced in the interim), we might not hear about it until a couple hours before that.

Until then, the latest …

  • Buster Olney was on SportsCenter today explaining that the Dodgers and the Cubs can’t find common ground on a trade (although I have a strong sense that they thought they were close, as of yesterday – I can’t help but guess the Dodgers felt the Cubs would eventually compromise, but instead, the Cubs are sticking to their guns, however high that request might be). Olney says the Dodgers have told the Cubs that their “high-end prospects” are off limits (I assume that means Zach Lee), but says the situation can change in one phone call (in other words, “I don’t want to look bad if the Dodgers and Cubs announce a trade today”). Olney added on Twitter that “other teams are being aggressive.”
  • Dylan Hernandez reports (as of late last night) that Dempster remains a “primary” target for the Dodgers. Jon Heyman reported something similar, again, late last night.
  • Jayson Stark, who says there’s a 99% chance Dempster is dealt, quotes an executive whose team has been scouting Dempster heavily: “Here’s the problem. He’s leading the league in ERA, so they want par value back. But in reality, he’s a middle-to-end-of-the-rotation pitcher, and you’ve only got him for a couple of months. So is it worth what you’re being asked to give up?” I can understand and appreciate the disconnect between Dempster’s current performance and his projected performance over the rest of the year, but middle-to-end-of-the-rotation? Come on, dude. Setting aside 2011, Dempster has been a middle-to-front-of-the-rotation guy going on five years. He’s not an ace, but neither is he a four or a five.
  • The weirdest bit on Dempster came from Kevin Goldstein, who, himself, admitted what his source had told him was weird. The source said the Cubs are targeting pitching from the Dodgers that could be pitching at Wrigley Field THIS year. That’s weird because, while I’m sure the Cubs would like MLB-ready pitching, and would accept guys who could be pitching in the bigs later in 2012, why would they specifically be targeting 2012 pitchers? Surely they’d rather get 20 to 22-year-old pitching prospects, no? Maybe the source is referring to the Cubs wanting to pick up, as a throw in, someone who can fill in for Dempster and Matt Garza in the second half (if Garza is traded as well)?
  • Ken Rosenthal reports that the Braves, seen by many as the second most likely destination for Dempster, have had only general conversations with the Cubs about Dempster, and have not discussed specifics.
  • Jon Morosi tweets that the Tigers remain interested in Dempster (last we heard, they’d backed off), who Morosi says is still scheduled to pitch tonight.
  • Jon Heyman says the Nationals are “trying hard” on Dempster, as well as the Tigers. The Dodgers are still the favorite, according to at least one GM.
  • I would be surprised if Dempster starts tonight.
  • http://www.worldseriesdreaming.com dabynsky

    I guess I am worried about what the meaning of high-end prospects. Seems like that means to include more than just Zach Lee.

  • Chef

    So, if nothing happens by 6 pm CST, does Dempster take the mound tonight?

    • http://www.worldseriesdreaming.com dabynsky

      I would imagine yes, but I guess I wouldn’t rule out Dempster getting pulled right before or even a few innings into the game with a spot starter in the pen (Coleman or Germano). This is a fascinating game of chicken that the Cubs and Dodgers are playing right now.

      • cubmig

        This is a fascinating game of chicken that the Cubs and Dodgers are playing right now.

        [dabynsky]

        If this is a game of chicken the Cubs want to win, wouldn’t it make sense to let Dempster pitch as he normally has to let the Dodgers see they’re playing a losing game?

        • http://www.worldseriesdreaming.com dabynsky

          Perhaps, but does the odds of winning trade outweight the risk that a guy that is making his third start off the DL gets hurt again? Not being privy to what is going behind closed doors none of us can really answer it, but that is why I am so intrigued.

  • King Jeff

    If other teams are only viewing him as a back end of the rotation guy, then the Cubs should hold onto him, and either re-sign him, or get the draft pick for him if he walks.

    • http://www.worldseriesdreaming.com dabynsky

      The comment of middle to back end guy reads like posturing either to depress Dempster’s value or to make it easier if their team misses out on him. That said the real Dempster is probably a mid 3 ERA pitcher which is good, but not worth a top 50 prospect like Lee when you are only getting that mid 3 ERA pitcher for two months.

      • djriz

        Unless that guy is what it takes to get to the playoffs. That’s added money for the franchise and good public relations for the new ownership group. Could be worth the risk?

        • http://www.worldseriesdreaming.com dabynsky

          In no trade market has a guy like Ryan Dempster been worth a Zach Lee. Last year, tons of eyebrows were raised when the Giants parted with Zach Wheeler for Carlos Beltran, and Wheeler wasn’t the prospect Zach Lee is today. I understand the Cubs shooting for the moon, but my guess is the Cubs are haggling for guys lower on the pecking order like Eovaldi (going by Goldstein’s tweet) and the Dodgers want to part with Gould plus.

          • EQ76

            Lee could be coming if it’s a packaged deal including many more players and prospects. Straight Lee for Dempster, probably not, but if this becomes an 8 player trade, maybe.

          • Jonski

            I don’t no what the hell is so great about Zack Lee…Yes he is the Dodgers #1,but what would he be in a good system .The Dodger’s system is shit now we can dance around this ,but I just went over there he is no top 50 or even top 100.

            • Mick

              He was a multi-sport HS star who earned a full-ride scholarship to LSU to be their starting QB. He’s pitched well in the Dodgers system and has advanced quickly for his age. His stuff, athletecism, and make-up have him projected to be a top of the rotation starter in the majors. After him, the Dodgers have depth-quality pitchers who project as middle of the rotation at best so, if the Cubs were going to make a trade it makes sense that they’ve targeted the prospect that would yield the greatest return. The trouble is Demp isn’t the type of player that can yield said return by himself. That’s where the inclusion of some pieces from the Cubs side could make sense to help balance the trade for both teams. It’s yet to be seen which prospects would be included but names like Vitters, Dolis, Barney, and LaHair have been floated around.

              • Jonski

                Ok fair enough didn’t realize all that ,but would you agree that if we were to add a guy like Vitters or maybe say Jackson that they would have to part with not just Lee,but maybe Reed too.See this is how I see it is that once Demp goes to Dodgers they have the best bargaining chip for extension in friend and ex teammate Ted Lilly

                • Mick

                  Demp won’t be the only FA SP on the market and he’s no spring chicken. He’d make for a feel good signing if he were to come back, sort of what Kerry Wood’s signing was this past off-season but whether or not the FO views Demp in their long-term plans remains to be seen. In regards to adding Vitters or Jackson and that automatically meaning Reed would need to be included, I would be inclined to say yes. But there are a lot of factors at play such as organizational depth, what the Dodgers’ scouts have determined on Vitters and Jackson, what the Cubs’ scouts and FO have determined on Vitters and Jackson, etc.

            • http://www.bleachernation.com Luke

              He was ranked as high as #35 league wide in the preseason.

              • http://www.worldseriesdreaming.com dabynsky

                And BA had him at 49 and Sickels at 42 on their midseason lists. The guy is guaranteed to be a stud, but he is a type of prospect that you just don’t get for 11 starts of Ryan Dempster.

            • Drew7

              “…but I just went over there he is no top 50 or even top 100.”

              - Zach Lee was #30 on fangraph’s top 100 prospects coming into this season. The list was re-ranked midseason, and now has him at #26…

              http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/fangraphs-top-50-prospects/#more-92484

              • Jonski

                Yeah well Mick set me straight all I was saying is that info wasn’t on the Dodgers website sorry for the goof… The Cubs are going to have to add a lot to get him and I don’t like Gould might be time for them to move on from the Dodger’s .

    • Mick

      Why wouldn’t Dempster accept a 1-year $12.5 million qualifying offer from the Cubs? The guy loves Chicago and the Cubs and there’s no way he’s making an annual $12.5 million if he signs someplace else. Maybe he gets a 2-year deal for around $15 million? In summation, the Cubs absolutely need to trade Demp but I believe have the leverage to force a team to pony up a better prospect due to the lack of better alternatives.

      • Edwin

        I don’t understand. How do the Cubs have the leverage to force other teams to pony up better prospects but at the same time are in a position where they “must” trade Dempster?

        • Grant

          The only reason the Cubs “must” trade Dempster is because of the value he’s likely to bring back in terms of prospects. If someone balks at the price, the Cubs only have to look to one of the other dozen teams who would like to have the pitcher with the majors-leading ERA as part of their rotation for the remainder of the season/playoffs.

        • Mick

          Because it’s a sellers’ market and the Cubs have the last ice-cream cones at the concession stand. We must sell that cone before it melts but there are 4 kids who really want that ice-cream.

          • Edwin

            But if the kids know that we need to sell our ice cream cone, why should they pay more than the sticker price of the cone? Especially when they could spend their money on cotton candy instead. It might not be as good as the ice cream cone, but it’s a more efficient way to spend their allowance. They also might be saving up for pizza, and would prefer to save their money for a longer term solution instead of just a quick snack.

          • Edwin

            Plus, it’s hot out, and we still need a treat as well. If we do sell our last cone, we could call up a half eaten candy bar from our pocket, but if the other 4 kids won’t give us what we want we could just eat the ice cream cone ourselves.

            • Mick

              Those kids won’t buy the cotton-candy because they’ve already got cotton candy every fifth day on their menu. They want the ice-cream cone because that’s what’s going to push them over the edge and allow them to go out and play with the big kids in October. And if we want more ice-cream cones for the future so that we can go out and play with the big kids in October we’ll need sell the cones we have now and call up our half-eaten candy bars for the next couple of years.

              • Ryan

                Thanks to Mick and Edwin, my diet plans are ruined haha

              • Edwin

                But is the ice cream cone really so much better than the cotton candy that it makes that big of a difference? I mean, it’s only one ice cream cone, and while it started at 2 scoops, now it’s down to just one scoop remaining.

  • Dan

    I hope Dempster doesn’t pitch tonight. If there’s any team that can ruin the Cubs future, its the Cardinals. Dempster getting rocked today would hurt his trade value greatly. I don’t think Dempster pitching a great game will change anything. I suspect the Cubs will use another player in place of Dempster. I’m almost 100% certain.

    • http://www.worldseriesdreaming.com dabynsky

      While I would also be surprised to see him pitch, I don’t think Dempster getting rocked would hurt his value. I don’t think teams are convinced that Dempster is more than he is because of the run he is on. I think the only that would damage his trade value is him getting hurt.

    • JulioZuleta

      Getting rocked would have extremely little to no impact whatsoever on his value. The only thing that could really hurt it is an ijury, which is always a possibility. I think there’s a very small chance he pitches tonight.

    • Dan

      Dempster getting rocked tonight might be the difference between getting Zack Lee or Chris Withrow and Garret Gould. Theo is going for the big catch and Dempster is as hot as can be.

      • http://www.worldseriesdreaming.com dabynsky

        My opinion of Ned Colletti would be quite low if that is really the mindframe he is at on trade. People know what Ryan Dempster is, and a sub 2 ERA pitcher he is not.

        • EQ76

          Yep! and with prospects, you never know what you’re gonna get.. Demp is the only sure thing in the deal we end up making. There was a day when we considered guys like Pie, Patterson, Juan Cruz completely untouchable. I bet we wish we could have traded some of them back in the day.

          • EvenBetterNewsV2.0

            Hindsight is always easy. Every team has untouchables for a reason. Those players are the ones who give you the best chance to get a superstar and seem to have high end ability at that point for their age. So many variables to why they don’t pan out, but outside of the Yankees how many teams live purely off of Free Agents? You have to have homegrown talent coming up from the minors to be successful. There is a reason we haven’t won a World Series for so long and teams like the Cardinals have. Their farm is better than ours annually. They have a recurring door from the minors that produces talent. Maybe some of the players mentioned who have failed wouldn’t have been so important if they weren’t some of our only top prospects of the the last 25 years? No?

        • Aaron

          Well, it is true that some pitchers get better with age. Dempster is having a phenomenal year, for sure. He’s getting older, yes. However, he has been effective, which is what these playoff contenders want – even for just a couple months. The whole question we’re at now – Is a top prospect worth a couple months of service? – is a good one to scoff at and say “No way!” But what if these teams get down to the wire and miss the playoffs by 2 or 3 wins? In hindsight, a GM may be ok selling off a guy who right now is a question mark in their system (and let’s face it, all prospects are question marks) for a pitcher who can deliver them a playoff or wildcard berth.

      • terencemann

        Zach Lee is probably untouchable. The Dodgers have other pitching prospects who would work.

        Also, the Cubs probably wouldn’t make Dempster a qualifying offer if he sticks around as they can probably re-sign him for less in the off-season. It doesn’t make sense not to trade him even if the best offer is not what Theo co. had in mind.

      • Dan

        In general, I think they can persuade one GM out there to make that deal that blows away Theo and company. If the Cubs can get Travis Wood plus junk for Sean Marshall, then they can get Dempster for Zach Lee. Theo, don’t let Dempster pitch tonight!!!

      • JulioZuleta

        Again, Lee isn’t on the table. If he was the deal would already be done. He definitely has been overrated by all these talks though…

        Anyways, getting rocked really wouldn’t hurt his value. However, he has been on the DL twice this year so there’s really no need to risk injury. Doubt he pitches.

    • Quintz

      Dempster’s value (barring injury) is set. One bad or good outing isn’t going to change anything at this point. So while the possibility of an injury is fairly low, I would prefer he not pitch to avoid even the smallest chance of something going wrong.

      I do feel a little offended when he is described as a middle to back of the rotation guy. That being said, if I put my personal like for Dempster aside, he’s probably a solid number three guy. Not a one or two on a good team, a three on an average team and maybe a four on top five staffs. It’s hard to find any team where he would be a number five guy.

  • ColoCubFan

    I figured in my own mind that this is basically what’s going on. Cubs value him more than other teams, especially considering that he’s a 2-3 month rental.

  • AD

    Brett, is their any one prospect from the Nationals that particularly excites/interests you?

    • http://www.bleachernation.com Luke

      Any of their top seven or eight would be quite nice. The first few aren’t terribly realistic, but the later end of that range could be in play.

      http://washington.nationals.mlb.com/mlb/prospects/watch/y2012/#list=was

      • Ryan G

        Package around Alex Meyer maybe? He’s a much more Theo pitcher than Purke.

      • Puma0821

        I would like a package around Goodwin and Solis! Does that sound realistic?

  • Dan

    The Cubs have time to sit back and wait till the 31rst. Let the offers come in and hopefully there will be one offer, just one offer that they are blown away and make the deal. Stay the course Theo, stay the course.

    • http://www.bleachernation.com Luke

      I think the Cubs are trying to get Dempster moved soon so his presence on the market does not deflate offers for Garza. Basically, the Cubs are afraid of competing against themselves and driving their own prices downward.

      • AD

        Matt Purke is an interesting name.

      • MightyBear

        Luke is right. This includes Maholm who is not frontline like Demp or Garza but is still a valuable left handed starter.

  • TonyP

    My money is on him starting tonight…

  • Big Lez

    By wanting pitching for “this year,” isn’t it possible that the Cubs are asking for Dodgers prospect Nathan Eovaldi, who is currently in the majors?

    • ETS

      my guess is they mean a throw in to help out if demp, garza and maybe even maholm all get traded. We just don’t have AAA pitchers that are ready to be mlb starters.

  • Stu

    I love how teams try to pigeon hole players even though their “performance” dictates something else. Dempster is leading the league in ERA so he is now a front-line pitcher by definition.

    Look at Jose Bautista a few years ago and how he was categorized a certain way. No one thought he would be a dominant home run hitter. Is it so crazy to think that sometimes a player puts it together later in his career?

    • Ben

      Well, I don’t disagree with other teams wanting to look at his historical numbers, and using that as part of the decision. However, the fact that he is pitching like an ace raises his value, no matter what other teams want to think. If Demp had a 6 ERA, no one would be in line to acquire him.

    • Edwin

      Maybe some teams don’t think that Dempster’s ERA is a good example of his true talent level.

    • Drew7

      Dempster is a middle-to-front end starter pitching LIKE an ace now, but it is overwhelmingly probable that he will regress back to the former. At 36, I think this run he’s having is a very well-timed combination of his skill and luck, rather than him “figuring it out”.

      • Grant

        It seems that he’s turned to a Maddux-like pitcher, hitting his locations and out-thinking batters. I suspect his ample time with Greg rubbed off on him.

    • Big Lez

      In Dempster’s case, yes, it is a bit crazy…. Why? Well the advanced metrics tell us why….He currently is sports a .242 BABIP, which is bound to regress (even in Dempster’s best season in 2008, he posted a .280 BABIP with a 2.96 ERA). His LOB% is also an unsustainably high 85.5% (for most pitchers this is around 70%—for the best in the game like a Verlander, LOB% can reach 75-80% but more than that is completely unsustainable). He’s HR/FB is a career low (for most pitchers this is around 10%–Dempter’s career is 10.2%–this year he’s hovering at 6.7%)….He’s striking out fewer batters than ever before, he has his lowest ground ball % since his 2002 season (in which he posted a 5.38 ERA)…He is walking fewer batter which is absolutely a good sign.

      All these factors play into the potential return Dempster will get. Cubs will shoot high–as they should–but other teams will point to all the #’s above (and probably more that they have, and I don’t) to suggest that his value is not nearly as high as his 1.86 ERA would suggest. Anyone getting him should expect some regression…the job for Theo is to convince teams that his regression will be less than what some think.

  • kirby

    need to keep him off the mound tonight, in my opinion. I think it is going to be a hectic 6 hours or so. Do the Nats swoop in and undercut the Dodgers? That is some good stuff.

  • Dustin S

    Nothing good that could come from him pitching tonight, so I hope they keep him out. If he does, I would assume it’s another team saying “well let us see him throw 1 more time” before they pull the trigger.

    • http://www.worldseriesdreaming.com dabynsky

      I wouldn’t be shocked if a team wanted to see him go past 90 pitches before ponying up for Dempster. He has been on a real tight pitch count the first two starts back from the DL. That would be the only reason to trot him out. Well that and leverage if teams are going to call Theo and Jed’s bluff.

      • Boogens

        Dempster threw 90 pitches last Saturday. Another 10 or so isn’t going to make a difference.

    • willis

      He could help the team beat the Cardinals. That’s something good.

  • Ryan G

    What a game the Cubs management is playing right now. I love it. Holding strong and making the other teams give in.

  • BD

    By targeting “2012 pitchers,” couldn’t that mean they want somebody who is MLB-ready? I guess I thought when they stated they were looking to get back MLB-ready pitching, they could still be good prospects who are ready to come up (as soon as this year).

  • Mike S

    I had a dream last night that the Cubs traded Dempster to the Cardinals for Shelby Miller. Then Dempster pitched in tonight’s game and we scored 4 runs in the 1st inning…

  • http://www.bleachernation.com Luke

    Zach Lee is, of course, the biggest name in the Dodgers system, but I think I would just as happy with the Cubs could land Allen Webster in a package instead. He’s a groundball pitcher with advanced breaking stuff who could easily be in the majors next season. His ceiling isn’t quite as high as Lee’s, but he has the potential to be a solid No 2/3 starter.

    • http://www.bleachernation.com Brett

      I like Webster as a possibility, but he’s just not in the same arena as Lee – for one thing, he’s two years older and has two and a half more years of professional experience, yet is still at the same level as Lee.

      • Mike S

        Don’t forget, the Top 20′s that we are looking at are different than the Top 20′s that the Front Office is looking at. The Cubs Top 20 is different now with Almora, Soler, Underwood, etc. I’d assume that there are some names that Theo and Co. have in mind that we might not know of.

    • MightyBear

      I agree with Luke. Webster is a converted shortstop and has been pitching well in the short time he’s been on the mound. Not sure the Dodgers want to give him up but I would be very happy if they got Webster.

      • http://www.bleachernation.com Brett

        Maybe I’m missing something, but Webster’s been a pitcher his entire time in the Dodgers system (since 2008, when he was 18).

        • http://www.bleachernation.com Luke

          The Dodgers drafted him as a shortstop, but then immediately converted him to pitching. I don’t believe he pitched full time before joining the Dodgers. That’s part of why the Dodgers left him in Rookie ball for two years.

          In terms of total pitching experience, Lee likely has significantly more despite being younger.

          • http://www.bleachernation.com Brett

            Not professional – to me, that makes a substantial difference. I don’t much care about a 20 to 22-year-old prospect’s high school pitching experience.

            • http://www.bleachernation.com Luke

              From what I can tell (high school numbers from that far back are tough to find, so I’m going on second and third hand sources), he barely pitched at all in high school. He was not the typical two-way prospect. He was a shortstop who occasionally took the mound.

              Whereas Lee was learning how to pitch in high school, Webster wasn’t. Age with respect to level is an extremely good indicator of a prospect’s value, but I’m not convinced it is as relevant in a case like this, in which a player has been asked to learn a very different position and skill set after turning professional.

              That said I’d rather have Lee, but I don’t think the gap between them is very large at all.

              • Ryan G

                Eovaldi and De La Rosa aside, I’d rank their pitching prospects as follows:

                1. Lee, obviously.
                2. Reed
                3. Martin
                4. Webster
                5. Gould
                6. Withrow

                According to Buster, Dodgers have made a long list of their prospects unavailable, so I wouldn’t be surprised if Gould and Withrow are the o ly guys they’re willing to discuss, and that just won’t get it done.

  • MightyBear

    I thought I read he was a converted shortstop. I may be wrong. It may have been another prospect mentioned in the rumors. They’re starting to run together.

  • NCMoss

    Wait, I thought this post was updated? Or was the whole thing an update?

  • AD

    I see that the Rays would consider trading Jeremy Hellickson (Reining AL Rookie of The Year) was has regressed slightly this year, but remained pretty solid considering he pitches in the AL East. Hellickson seems like a talented, controllable pitcher that the Cubs should target. So my question is, Could a package of Soto, LaHair, and Vitters land Hellickson and would it be worth it?

    • http://www.bleachernation.com Luke

      I doubt that package would land him.

      • AD

        Luke, what kind of package do you think it would take? That plus a young pitcher that the Cubs clearly don’t have?

        • http://www.bleachernation.com Luke

          I haven’t heard yet what the Rays are looking for, but I suspect they would want Baez or Candelario to start with, plus a whole lot more.

          In a down year, he still has a WHIP of 1.354, and on top of that he is not a free agent until 2017. He is going to be extremely expensive.

      • http://www.bleachernation.com Brett

        It wouldn’t come close. Would require something of the caliber (not these exact guys) of two or three of a Brett Jackson, Dillon Maples, Matt Szczur, and yes, Jorge Soler, Albert Almora. Again, those are just the types.

    • Edwin

      Unless scouts see something changing for him in the future, I’d pass. A flyball pitcher with average control who doesn’t strike anyone out? Pass.

    • Quintz

      I’m not sure if the Rays would be offended or amused if the Cubs offered LaHair, Soto and Vitters for Hellickson?

  • RY34

    the idiot who said demp is a “middle to end rotation” guy should be punched squarely in the face. what a moron.

    • ETS

      [img]http://www.boomantribune.com/files/477/moran.jpg[/img]

      • Shawn H

        I give that guy an A for effort. Its tough to find cardinal fans who can write, let alone spell.

        • Quintz

          ……but very easy to find one with a mullet.

        • stillmisskennyhubbs

          Hmmm, looks like a typical St. Louis brain vendor to me…..Maybe he’s selling knockoff Ted Williams’s?

      • Jon

        What do you want to bet that guys got some jorts on too?

  • Jason “Thundermug”

    Ok am I missing something but why are they so adamate about a 3rd base prospect when they have one in Iowa name is Josh Vitters.

    Why not see what he can do while Baez and Candalerio work there way through the minors. I doubt the best 3b prospects are available.

    • ETS

      Vitters mysteriously didn’t play last night. Is it possible that he has been in the trade talks with Dempster? A package deal? Probably not, but maybe…

  • http://bleachernation.com lou brock lives

    With the recent Cub turnaround at the ML level the FO has become concerned with how the rest of the season ” plays out “. They do not have the starting pitching to even “compete” should they trade all 3 of the pitchers being mentioned as on the block – Dempster, Maholm, & Garza.
    Randy Wells is hurt, Volstad is terrible, & Coleman struggles at best. The Cubs still want to try & be somewhat competitive over these last 70 games. This is why I believe Goldstein’s report has some credence. It also somewhat narrows the Cubs trading partners to those clubs who have experienced ML pitching available on their rosters or at AAA. I believe this is why they picked up J. Germano & why the Braves & Nationals are the most likely trading partners for Dempster. Atlanta has Jurjjens & DelGado while the Nationals have J.Lannan & Z. Duke at AAA. The Dodgers do have John Ely at AAA doing pretty well but I believe the Cubs & Dodgers are not a good fit on Dempster. The Cubs more than likely are asking for a top prospect as well as a experienced ML starter for Dempster. This is not a bad way to go about this deal – if in fact Goldstein’s info is correct.

    • Quintz

      I’m guessing Zach Duke isn’t high on the Cubs wish list.

    • stillmisskennyhubbs

      Not sure I agree with your premise: “the FO has become concerned with how the rest of the season ” plays out “.”
      I think the FO is rightly, as stated over and over, showing that their concern is building a solid base for tomorrow and afterwards. “Waves and waves of arms”….Yep, that may mean some young guys who might step up this year, but they’d be valueless stopgaps if we acquire them just to have a passable rotation this year.
      The team is squeezing its talent to the max right now. That’s a tribute to the overall leadership, the clubhouse chemistry, and the coaching, and yes, the manager. I can live with losing a lot this year, as long as they continue to hustle and learn to grow.

      • Cyranojoe

        Agreed.

  • nick cafardo

    Garza and Demp are going to the red sox as theo comp. Not sure where these other rumors are coming from..

    • ETS

      only if castro is included is that acceptable.

      • Frank

        And Rizzo, Vitters, Jackson, Soler and Almora . . .

        • DH

          … And a PTBNL; probably Baez…

    • calicubsfan007

      I am kind of hoping Theo trades one of the two pitchers to the Red Sox, because I will know without a doubt that we are getting a decent return at the very least.

  • nick cafardo

    Maybe. I’ve heard the sox wish he walked more. Almora and soler may be close.

  • Cheryl

    For what its worth, Dempster is in the starting lineup tonight.

    • http://bleachernation.com someday…2015?

      If Demp starts tonight it will be the first time I will truly question this FO. I really don’t see any good that comes from Demp pitching tonight. He has already hit his value peak. Now where gonna risk injury and a terrible performance… Yeah I’ll be extremely surprised to see Dempster pitching/in the starting Line up tonight.

  • Kevin

    Have you seen Lee’s #’s this year? He is an overrated pitcher in a bad farm system. The Cubs would be wise to deal with another team.

    • kubphan82

      I agree. I’d stay away from Lee, Webster, and Withrow. Gould walks too many, that’s not a Theo quality, though he has 3 solid pitches.

    • Adam

      Yeah… he’s also 20 years old at AA with a bunch of people 3 or 4 or more years older than him. He’ll be just fine.

  • kubphan82

    Color me silly if it happens, but there’s no way Dempster hauls Zach Lee, in no type of performance from him does his value increase to snag Lee. His performance tonight, if shelled, would not warrant a decrease in value for potential prospects.

    The only setback would be an injury. However, Dempster has been a 200 inning workhorse, who had a bad start to last year but a mighty fine career with the Cubs.

    Withrow has fallen to be a RP stuck in AA for 3(?) years because he’s just a thrower. Potential SP again, maybe, but not right now. Apparently Lee lost some velocity on his fastball. Eovaldi has 5 minor league seasons under his belt now, if he were a Cub people would be writing him off for pitching well in his fifth season at lowly AA. Same with Webster and years except he’s struggling this year.

    The Cubs best bet would be a combination of Chris Reed and Ethan Martin or Miguel Sulbaran… Personally, I don’t know what the book is on Sulbaran but if he’s not on the table the Cubs should look into bringing him in.

    • ETS

      I thought there’s no way Puig signs for $42m but there ya go…

      • kubphan82

        Well don’t bet on the Cubs even asking for Lee… So far Lee’s name was name dropped solely because he’s a top pitching prospect and that’s what the Cubs are looking for.

      • stillmisskennyhubbs

        Yeah, that little Puiggy went to market !!

  • Kevin

    Color me silly too …….. Lee is overrated, the Cubs should look elsewhere.

    • ETS

      I’d take lee over shelby miller. maybe I’m really bad at this though.

  • Kevin

    The Dodgers report, through the media on a daily basis, that they have a trade proposal on the table. The same story is reported everyday, nothing has changed. If the offer was good, the Cubs would have pulled the trigger. This daily reporting the same story is getting very old.

    • JoeyCollins

      Completely agree. Not sure how many times in how different many ways people can say that the dodgers are still involved, negotiatins are ongoing. I’m really dying for something to happen already.

  • Nathan

    One would assume that if the Dodgers are really interested in Dempster, they would be a little more aggressive with their offer. I am really not high on their system after the first couple of players. If we cannot get at least one of their “untouchables” we should move on to bigger and better places.

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