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A little bit ago in the latest Lukewarm Stove, I noted that, unless the Los Angeles Dodgers were suddenly willing to include top pitching prospects Zach Lee, Allen Webster or Chris Reed in a deal for Ryan Dempster, it would be hard to argue that the talks between the Cubs and Dodgers were “gaining momentum” unless the Cubs were capitulating. And then Ken Rosenthal reported that the Cubs were “bending over backwards” to make a Dempster/L.A. deal happen.

Add those together, and you get the sense that none of those bigger three arms are being discussed in these talks.

And, unfortunately, Kevin Goldstein says that’s precisely the case. In a Twitter conversation that started with George Ofman tweeting that Garrett Gould – a lesser Dodgers pitching prospect – would likely be involved in a Cubs/Dodgers/Dempster trade, I noted that his inclusion would mean Lee and Webster were not included (on the belief that there’s no way the Cubs could get Gould AND one of Lee or Webster). Goldstein responded to me that Lee and Webster are “absolutely not in play for Dempster.” From there, Goldstein added that all three of Lee, Webster, and Reed are off the table in the Dempster talks.

Obviously you have to regard all rumors this time of year suspiciously – the Dodgers have an incentive to put the word out that they won’t part with a top piece for Dempster, a guy they’ve said they don’t really like (more spin?), and a guy on whom the Cubs have very little leverage. But, if the Cubs move Dempster to the Dodgers, it sounds like it’s going to be a “multiple middling pieces” type deal rather than a “one top piece” deal.

UPDATE: We’re not going to do the update dance again, are we? (Answer to my own rhetorical question: no, probably not. Too many posts today given the BNBlogathon for me to keep updating just one. If big, new Dempster info comes forward, it’ll probably get its own post.) Jim Bowden says the Cubs ideally do want to get Dempster to LA (why? because that’s the only place he’ll go? or because they really are trying to do him a favor? I doubt that latter one), but they won’t take a crap return just to do it. You probably already knew this.

UPDATE 2 (at 3:32pm CT): Apparently Tim Kurkjian was on the radio today saying that, ultimately, he thinks the Braves will suck up their pride and put Randall Delgado back on the table for Dempster. That’s great and all, but it presumes Dempster will, in turn, finally relent and go to Atlanta. We’ve learned in recent days that he still might be willing to go there, but we certainly don’t know for sure.

UPDATE 3 (at 3:53pm CT): Jayson Stark tweets: “One exec who spoke with #Nationals says: ‘If I looked up and saw that Washington traded for Ryan Demoster it wouldn’t be a surprise.'” It would be a surprise to me, if only because we don’t yet know that Dempster would accept a trade to DC. It wouldn’t surprise me in the sense that Dempster is a perfect fit for the Nats.

UPDATE 4 (at 2:12am CT): Ken Rosenthal says he’s got sources telling him Dempster “remains adamant that he will only approve a trade to the Dodgers.” Maybe everything in the last few days has been mere spin control after all.

  • Scott

    If a trade with the Nationals was to materialize what prospects do you think the Cubs would target?

  • curt

    enough is enough tell the dodger dogs to get bent.the cubs shouldnt take scraps just 2 make a deal.

    • Tommy

      That’s how I feel, Curt. Well put.

      Being bullied into accepting less (way less) than what was already offered (Delgado) is crazy. I don’t blame the Dodgers for trying to get the best deal possible, but I don’t see any reason to continue to deal with them as they continue to put more and more of their prospects on their ‘untouchable’ list.

      When I read that stuff, it reminds me of dealing with that one guy in every fantasy football league that always finished in the bottom half of the league because he constantly overvalues his own players and thinks everyone is crazy for not making the trade where he’s giving up 5 backup/bench players for Drew Brees and Brandon Marshall.

  • Kevin

    Maybe if the Braves waive their right to make a qualifying offer next year Dempster might be more open to Atlanta.

    • http://www.bleachernation.com Luke

      Not sure how that would matter to Dempster. If he doesn’t want to stay in Atlanta he can always decline the offer and hit the open market.

    • nkniacc13

      They can’t make an arbitration offer only the Cubs can

    • WGNstatic

      Not an issue.

      First, the braves, or whatever team lands Dempster cannot get draftpick compensation for him. Under the new CBA, players need to be with their team for the full season in order for the team to get draftpick compensation.

      Second, I guess the new CBA rules only give the team a sandwich pick, the signing team no longer has to give up a draft pick for compensation. So, even if the Cubs do offer Dempster a qualifying offer, and he turns them down, that won’t negatively impact his value on the free agent market.

      • http://www.bleachernation.com Brett

        The signing team still loses a pick (the difference now is that the pick doesn’t go to the former team).

  • nkniacc13

    Apparently not any of their top prospects atleast that was as last week

  • Kevin

    I stand corrected, just looking at all angles

  • Kevin

    #1, don’t ever believe what a ball player says, if it’s not written down, it’s just cheap talk.

  • Jeff

    I hate to say this but if Ned Colletti continues to low ball his offer on the Cubs, I say don’t give Dempster away. I know we might not re-sign him or give him a qualifying offer, but there are always August trades too. I hate being low balled by an arrogant GM. If you wanna win now, pay up sucker

  • AC

    Keep up the great work!! Since discovering your site….I’ve become a junkie. Heck I’ve been checking back in every five minutes all night. As far as Demp goes, spin / no spin, yes / no, only here / only there……..at this point I’d be happy if Theo traded him to LA for a water cooler and sunflower seeds to be named later!!!!!

    • http://www.bleachernation.com Brett

      Thanks, AC.

      • Jeff

        Brett, you picked a good time for a blog-a-thon week, full moon fever out this week.

    • kubphan82

      No, Theo/Jed need to stick to their guns and show everybody they’re not afraid to take almost nothing by holding onto a player than taking some garbage deal just to save some face. It’s not always about the current deal, it’s about marking your territory in the trade industry as well.

      How bad do the Dodgers want to win now? The Cubs aren’t so concerned with winning this year, and they’ll have different avenues to win in the future… Dodgers are the ones who will lose something by not folding.

      • Scotti

        E X A C T L Y !

        The Cubs are not the team in contention and they don’t need to dump salary. Even Dempster cannot force a trade. Win-win, or no deal [© S. Covey].

        • MichiganGoat

          my only problem with that is what will it do to the clubhouse. we are bringing up a bunch of young kids shortly and do we really want a bitter Dempster that will get booed and constantly questioned over this or do we want the discussion to be about the progression and development of the new core. I saw trade him and expect that the return will disappoint us, just move on.

          • Jeff

            Or the kiddies can see how a player can be vilified by fans when he acts without thinking and it can be a lesson to them on how to act when they are in the last year of their contract and are trade speculation. Dempster loves being a Cub and he has been a good ambassador but he really should have had an exit strategy already planned out for this. He knew the team wasn’t going to be competitive and he knew he should be prepared to be traded.

            I can’t really blame him for not wanting to leave the Cubs, It’s not like any of us that are still up at 4am are willing to be trade to the fan base of another team either, the Cubbies, while losers are definitely loveable and Dempster loves being a Cub.

            You can’t fault him for that because it calls your allegiance into question too

            • MaxM1908

              If Dempster is so loyal to being a Cub, why has he made it perfectly clear that he wants to be a Dodger? I think the fans would be more foregiving of him if he said, “I don’t want to play for any other team but the Cubs, and I’ll block any trade because I love this team so much I don’t want to leave.” That’s not what he’s done. He indicated early on that he would go to either Atlanta or LA, and then to just LA. I don’t think I’ve ever heard him once say or heard any rumors to the effect that he’s being difficult because he wants to remain a Cub.

              • Scotti

                You didn’t watch him with reporters after today’s game then. He talked about how hard it would be to leave the fans, Cubs, 9 years here, etc. Everything short of Dunston’s “I’ll always be a Cub.” Look, the Cubs have asked to trade him, he didn’t ask them. Of course those facts don’t change anything, do they. For most fans it’s about emotions. That’s ok. Sport is emotional. But there is no need to demonize Dempster. Just think of it like a divorce: Daddy and Mommy still love eachother but sometimes Daddys want new Mommys but they don’t want the old Mommys to take all their money away so, if you could just tell the nice judge that Mommy gets drunk and beats you, Daddy will buy you some new prospects…

                • Adam1680

                  Scotti – We get it, Dempster is your favorite player and you have a man crush on him. To compare that with a divorce? You seem smarter than that.

                  The cubs took a chance on Dempster. Signed him when he was hurt and it panned out for both parties. Rebuilding is in effect and it’s time to move him while he has value. If he cared about the organization and blah blah like he says, he would want to see the best thing for the club. He’s not getting paid any less, he was asked to go to the Braves for 2 months!

                  It wouldn’t be so bad except he came right out and said that he wanted what was best for the Cubs in so many words.

                • MaxM1908

                  Ha ha. I liked where you went with that. As for Dempster’s comments, I’m not surprised that he’s changing his tune this late in the game. He’s feeling the ire from fans, so I’m not surprised that he’s trying to appeal to us on a different level to smooth things over. He gets no re-DEMP-tion from me.

                  • Scotti

                    Max, Dempster hasn’t changed his tune. Every time HE has said anything he has been consistent. When “sources” have spoken they’ve been all over the map. That’s because “sources” are one part imaginary friends, one part the guy who fixes the copy machine and one part intentional leaks meant to spin.

          • Scotti

            Goat, I don’t see a large influx of core players coming up. The core is either here or farther away. Maybe Vitters and Jackson get a September call up. Maybe you get a young but MLB ready guy for Garza. Regardless, Dempster is an excellent example to any young player of how to get ready for the game (he wasn’t always fit) and a very good example of how to handle the press (he’s handled the press very well through all of this–not something Z, Bradley, etc. could do).

            Regardless, this whole freak-out thing is 90% Internet related (websites, twitter, FB, etc.). If he starts tonight he’ll get as many, if not more, cheers than boos.

          • White Sox Nation

            You don’t make a trade just to make a trade and take what ever the other teams wants to give you. Think about a future deals with other teams when you need to make a move other GM’s are going to look at you like your a fool and treat you the same. You stick to your guns and they will move Demp and they should get a player or two that Jed / Theo want. And no way in hell should any Cub fan Boo Demp he pitched his ass off and gave it his all for 9 years here more then I can say for some ex Cubs. And before everyone jumps up and down and screams he cost the Cubs Delgado, Lets look at Minor, Beachy “Before he got hurt” Braves young pitchers and pitching well . Delgado 4-9 with a 4+ ERA!!!! I’m not saying the kid won’t be good but he could also be a bust as any young prospect can be.

            • MaxM1908

              I really don’t think you’re hitting at the heart of why fans would boo Dempster. It’s about the way he acted. The fact he tried to be all generous in the media to get the fans on his side, but in private was playing a different game. The fact he told the management one thing, wasting their time, and then renegging. He destroyed our leverage and left us with few options at the trade deadline. Knowing Delgado was the return definitely hurts him in fans’ eyes, but that’s not the only gripe we have with him. It’s more about his overall handling of the situation which really put the Cubs and the Front Office in a bad position.

              • Alex

                “Yes, I’m familiar with this syndrome. He’s a two-face.”

              • White Sox Nation

                I understand the how he played it Max but that is what he did and it’s any player with 10-5 rights to do this. Yes I would have liked to have seen some great young prospects in return and they still probably be some on the way. But to boo him for that I wouldn’t he is a class act who is a gamer day in and day out . And the front office and what goes on with players is out of our hands these guys make a ton of money and when it comes down to it there only concern is their happiness and well being they aren’t worried about the people who are paying for the tickets they just want people in the seats.

                • MaxM1908

                  As I said before, the booing is not for the prospects, it’s for the actions. And, as for the actions, simply doing something that is within one’s right doesn’t shield one from criticism. He made a conscious decision of how he wanted to act, and now he has to face the consequences for those actions. Exercising a right is not equal to being free from all criticism and judgment.

              • Scotti

                Max, just like kids in a divorce, we the fans have NO idea what the hell is really going on.

                • MaxM1908

                  I’ve never liked that excuse for apologists. Dempster is being tried by the jury of public opinion. When a jury trial occurs, they have no idea what really happened–they have to draw conclusions based upon the available evidence. In criminal law, we use a reasonable doubt standard. In civil law, it’s preponderance of the evidence. Under either standard, I feel I have enough evidence to convict Dempster in front of a jury of his peers. (Though, based on your responses, I would likely use one of my jury strikes against you.)

                  • Scotti

                    Max, that might make a bit of sense if the events that you are prosecuiting him for, weren’t still ongoing. This isn’t at the jury selection phase. It isn’t at the trial phase. It isn’t even at the investigation phase! This is ongoing. This is the “Don’t delete your email while we’re doing this because there is GOING to be an investigation” phase.

                    • http://www.bleachernation.com Brett

                      Hold letter!

                    • Scotti

                      Also known as the “Crap, why didn’t I send that from my personal email” or the “I just should have freakin’ called from my cell” letter.

                    • MaxM1908

                      I love it. Lawyer jokes! To be fair though, I do think we are in the investigation stage. This may just result in an ongoing conduct charge…

        • Alex

          Exactly.. One of the first rules of negotiation is to be prepared to walk away from a deal if it’s not agreeable for both sides.

          • Scotti

            If Theo takes a crappy return he’ll lose some of his shine for me. However, I can see the advantage he gains in allowing his position to seem “weak” until the deadline nears. If he seems too strong now, LA can choose plan B right now. If LA thinks Theo has no choice then LA may wait until they have only plan A and plan C (or even D) to choose from.

            Of course that isn’t exactly win-win or no deal. It’s more win-win or force a win. I can’t imagine that he has all of those Ivy League guys around him and he REALLY is doing this from a position of weakness. Must be a ploy.

  • Adam1680

    I’m not mad.. I’m disappointed in Dempster..

    So much for helping the team any way he can.

    • Scotti

      He never said that.

  • louis

    Good luck in Los Angeles Demp. He’s probably dreaming of hugging his teammates tonight with all the man love that went on earlier.
    Unrelated… I ordered my Bleacher Nation shirt today! Thanks for not sleeping Brett. We all appreciate your hard work!

  • AC

    Amen Adam, I’m with you 100%

  • gutshot5820

    I hope the Dodgers miss the playoffs by a game.

  • Sosascorkedbat

    I hope they get rid of that cry baby all he has been doing is toying with all of our emotions for far to long and i will literally cringe if i actually see that whiny little baby in a cubs uniform tomorrow

    • Jeff

      As much as we would like to be mad at Dempster, remember it is the L.A. GM who is stalling this trade by low balling their offer for Dempster. Hopefully, Jed and Theo told Colletti to piss off and only come back when they are ready to offer better prospects. They need to be exploring other options or resigned to not trading him at all. It’s a win win for our front office, because Dempster will draw the ire of Cubs fans if he continues to veto trades, not the front office for making a bad trade, just to move him.

      • Scotti

        Good post.

      • MaxM1908

        Agreed, except for you can’t really blame Coletti for using all the leverage Dempster has given him. I do think it would be unwise for the FO to do a bad trade and transfer the disgust away from Dempster.

        • Scotti

          Dempster only gave him leverage if he leaked the ATL deal. He didn’t, though.

          • MaxM1908

            I disagree. If the leak happens you say, “I’m really honored. Playing for Atlanta would be a wonderful opportunity. I have to weigh some options but this is really great news for me and the organization.”

            Instead, Dempster took to twitter and said, “There is no trade!” He told reporters how he was blindsided and upset. He had Sveum go out and say there’s no trade. He did everything possible to end all speculation that he could even possibly be going to Atlanta. He told his friends who leaked it to the press that he would only go to LA. He couldn’t control the leak, but he could sure as heck control how he responded to it.

            • Scotti

              No. Dempster heard that he was traded. Everyone on the Cubs side was reportedly pissed at that “leak” because it was a lie. He was simply never traded. His response? He hadn’t made up his mind yet. ATL was NOT out–he did NOT say no. That is 100% what he should have done to help the Cubs. Hell, if LA thought that Dempster WAS traded they could very well have pulled the trigger on their plan B (giving Theo zero leverage). So, yes, it really does seem to be the shiney new prospects. It certainly isn’t what Dempster actually ever really said or did.

        • Jeff

          Agreed, I just posted in another post that’s where I feel Dempster hasn’t helped his cause by acting the way he has. If he was smarter, he would have announced that he would only waive his 10/5 rights if L.A. would give him a 2yr 10M a yr extension. He gets a contract extension and L.A. doesn’t get a 2 month rental, they might be more apt to put a better prospect in the trade.

  • Tony S

    I’m glad weve at least got the Vizcaino trade to be happy about. its looking increasingly like we’ll get stiffed by the Dodgers.
    Hang in there Brett!

  • MaxM1908

    Classic Dempster. Saying one thing and then retracting. What a mensch.

    • NCMoss

      Classic? It’s been like a week.

      • MaxM1908

        That was the joke.

        • NCMoss

          Oh, my bad. It’s become a bit difficult to tell who is serious and who is joking when it comes to Dempster comments.

          • MaxM1908

            Well, I’m serious that I’m not happy with him, but I used “classic” facetiously since I though he was a stand-up guy eight days ago. You do have to admit that he’s flipped flopped so much in the past month or so though that it’s almost becoming “classic” behavior.

      • Scotti

        That’s, like, forever for a fly…

  • CubsBearsHawksBulls

    For Garza to Jays. We get Travis d’Arnaud C and Noah Syndergaard RHP/Daniel Morris LHP, Jays get Garza and Baker

    For Garza to Reds. We get Billy Hamilton SS, Mesoraco C and Robert Stephenson RHP, Reds get Garza, Vitters and a medium prospect

    For Garza to Red Sox Matt Barnes RHP and Ryan Lavarnway C, and the Red Sox get Garza and Soriano

    For Garza to Rangers. We get Mike Olt 3B and Jorge Alfaro C, Rangers get Garza, Soriano/Vitters, Baker/medium prospect ( might be giving up too much here)

    For Dempster to Nats. We get Anthony Rendon 3B and Sandy Leon C, Nats get Dempster and Soriano/Lahair

    For Dempster to Red Sox We get Matt Barnes RHP and Jackie Bradley OF/Ryan Lavarnway, Sox get Dempster and Soriano and Baker/Vitters

    For Vitters to Padres. We get Austin Hedges C, Padres get Vitters and medium/low prospects

    Some trade scenarios. fix ‘em, make new ones whatever

  • DCF

    Oh well, if the can’t take playing for ATL for a couple of weeks, why would you expect him to accept anything else than LA in the first place? Wouldn’t make any sense at all.
    Will be interesting to see what the Cubs can make of this mess.
    It has been said over and over again the Cubs shouldn’t make a trade just to make trade but with Dempster, I’m kinda feeling the opposite right now.
    The whole situation is a clusterfuck, but keeping Dempster and making him an offer is a pretty bad option as well. So if the Cubs can’t get more than a scrap heap prospect and some salary relief, oh well, that’s still better than getting nothing at all.

  • MaxM1908

    I really hope the FO doesn’t cave. Dempster should have to face the ire of the fanbase. He should have to feel our disappointment, anger, or whatever mixed-up emotions any fan may have toward him. He should know that his legacy with the Cubs is completely ruined. He should know he’ll always be a source of debate among Cubbie faithful; that any time his name is mentioned in a Cubs discussion, it will inevitably be followed by, “But you remember how he really screwed over the Cubs in the end, right?” It must really stink to know that in the blink of an eye you can go from completely loved, to at best dismissed, and at worst completely despised. I want him to feel and know that these last few months with the team. There should be no riding off into the sunset for him.

    • MichiganGoat

      Ah this point I no longer care just trade him

      • Jeff

        I wonder who dropped the ball so badly on this proposed trade, If I’m our front office and I know we have a Delgado for Dempster trade on the board, then I’m going to the Dodgers with a Hey, can you do better than that offer, use the leverage of missing out on a guy to make a team jump. Dempster definitely loses points for not helping the front office convince L.A. that he will go to Atlanta if the Dodgers don’t step up their offer.

        • MaxM1908

          I think you answered your own question there. Dempster made it apparent that he wouldn’t accept the trade. As soon as the Dodgers knew that, they knew they could just wait out the Atlanta offer and wait for the Cubs to come crawling…which they’ve done, numerous times now.

          • Scotti

            Didn’t happen. Dempster never nixed the ATL deal–he still hasn’t (openly). He DID say that he was going to take time to think it through. That gave LA time to jump in and up their offer if they had high interest. They don’t seem to like him like ATL did.

            • MaxM1908

              Let’s not split hairs here. Dempster did a pocket veto. Don’t let him off on a technicality.

              • art

                agree100%.

      • MaxM1908

        What purpose does it serve? At least if he sticks around we at least have the chance at getting a supplemental pick. With all the bridges Demp has burned in Chicago, I really don’t see him sticking around even if it is the best money he can get. And, if he does, well, we get another quality starter for next year–another transition year.

  • MichiganGoat

    This spin control BS is absolutely annoying, I wish Dempster was honest from the get go but oh well whatever at this point

    • Scotti

      “Honest from the get go” would have likely left the Cubs with LESS leverage than they have now… I just care that the Cubs get a good return if they trade him.

  • thejackal

    YEA DEMP WANNA GOTO LAD SO BAD N HE SCREWED US ON ATL DEAL I SAY THEN WE SCREW HIM AND THE DODGERS NOOO NTRADE DODGERS GM THINKN HE GETTN OVER ON US N HE HAS THE CUBS BY THE BALLS SO TO SPEAK THEN F%#3 you get to the playoffs without demp u wanna be stingy

    • White Sox Nation

      Screwed us or the Cubs? Didn’t know you were part of the cubs staff.

  • thejackal

    lmao we gt nuthn to lose a couple nobody prospects from LAD we good well keep him

  • dudeski

    yeah, screw you too, demp

  • Trent

    I think they need to cut the best deal possible for him and part ways. To receive a draft pick for him they will have to offer him a qualifying offer of $12.5million next year which he would be ignorant to turn down as a 35 year old pitcher who had an ERA over 4 last season. That’s money the cubs don’t need on their payroll with him just taking time from younger guys. Same for Soriano…

    • MaxM1908

      See, I’m not so sure he takes it. Not if fans do our part and let him know he’s not welcome here.

      • Trent

        I think after the attitude he’s shown the last week and a half he would be lucky to get half that per year in a new deal with a different team. If he doesn’t get traded he will be a Cub again next year. Which I do not want to see….

  • http://It'searly Mike F

    I really question if Dempster isn’t a media creation of his won making and pompous ass. Some the things he has said in the 24 hours are pretty revealing about his true character. And iI think Ned’s a skunk, but who can blame any of these teams for not wanting to pay Dempster when he’s acting like this, especially when Garza increasingly looks like he’s healthy. Not much of a contest there. No the ML clubs can live quite well without the Ryan Dempster traveling Circus and magic show. Then again the tribune and most Chicago plugged guys still maintain he’s going, even Sveum indicating that tonight too.

    Hey Brett I took and Ambien I’d give you one but don’t want to run naked through the streets and end up breaking your 30 hr vigil. You’re the man…… Oh I don’t have a lic to dispense drugs or medication either……

    • Jeff

      It’s time for a little Old School…We’re going STREAKING!!!!!!! Frank the Tank!!!!!!

  • DCF

    I fully agree regarding Dempster, but it’s not at all same for Soriano. Dempster is supposed to be out the door and off the books not matter what with weeks from now. Risking to pay him another 12+ million would really suck. Soriano is basically playing for free for 2 more years since he’s getting paid no matter what. If nobody wants to pay for him at least what he’s worth (which could easily be 1 WAR per year, equaling 10-12 million), there’s not point in a trade at all.

    • Jeff

      Totally agree..if someone is not willing to pay at least 9M, keep Soriano. He would easily get that in a free agency, especially after his performance this year

  • Trent

    I agree that he is easier to hold on to and will have value for the team next year too. I just think that right now he is having maybe his best year with the stick for the cubs and will just block chances for more young guys like Jackson or Campana from quality playing time.

    • Trent

      I think he has the highest possible value right now…that’s all.

  • Josh Las Vegas

    Hey Brett! This is my first post on our site! Im a huge cubs fan and im always on here reading the rumors! Love what you do and are you still taking donations?

  • Josh Las Vegas

    Ok perfect! Im a huge supporter of what you do! Its nice to only have to go to one site for all my cubs needs! By the way, I really hope garza goes to the reds for a package built around billy hamilton. Hopefully my wish will come true!

  • White Sox Nation

    Every one who is so down on Dempster for not wanting to go to Atlanta but for those Cub fans who are old enough to remember Ron Santo was trade to the Angels in 1973 he exercised his 10 and 5 rights. He ended up going to the White Sox for Steve Stone because he wanted to stay in Chicago did people give him crap for not wanting to go to the Angels and going to the South Side ?

    • Boogens

      So what if Santo refused to go to the Angels back in 1973? Did Santo tell the Cubs at first that he would approve a trade to the Angels and then back out because he wanted to play with his friend Wilbur Wood? Your argument doesn’t apply to the circumstances here. Here are the significant differences just off the top of my head between the situations that make them distinct from each other:

      1. Ronnie clearly didn’t want to be traded. The only reason he accepted a trade to the Sox is that it allowed him to stay in the city. He retired right after that one season because he was so miserable. Dempster said earlier in the season that he would approve a trade if it helped the Cubs.

      2. The only team name on Santo’s list would have been CUBS. Dempster had the Dodgers first then the Braves second and who knows what after that. Theo and Jed operated in good faith off of Dempster’s word that he would accept a trade to the teams DEMPSTER listed.

      3. Santo didn’t call / talk to some of the Angels players saying that he was coming there. Dempster did that with the Braves. Once it became known that he was hesitating the Braves players became angered and decided they didn’t want him there.

      4. Ronnie invoked his 10/5 rights RIGHT AWAY so everyone knew where they stood. Dempster merely had a hissy fit about the leak and never really invoked his rights that we know of. He just dragged his feet long enough so that the Braves would pull out of the deal (and so he wouldn’t look like the bad guy).

      5. Ronnie didn’t wistfully have a Michelob moment on the field with his buddies after a big game and later play a swansong game of catch with his sons before a game. Dempster publicly soaked in the last final moments, further demonstrating that he knew he was leaving and was willing to be traded.

      Last point, if it was as simple as you’re saying then why aren’t the fans as upset with Soriano as they are with Dempster for invoking his rights? Because Soriano didn’t mislead anyone. Dempster turned out to be a whiny prima donna. He’ll only accept a trade to the Dodgers but there’s no guarantee that the Dodgers will sign him beyond this season so all this drama is about a likely 2 month stint. Way to think that through, Ryan.

      I sincerely hope that this puts all the Ron Santo – Ryan Dempster 10/5 rights comparisons to bed. Quit comparing the two situations. They’re completely different.

  • J R

    Dempster quit banging the nanny and sign off on a trade you turd.

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