Quantcast

hall of fameAfter weeks of debate about steroids, eras, numbers, anecdotes, voting privileges, and any other number of frustrating things, the votes are in for the Hall of Fame … and it’s a goose egg. No one is getting in this time around, and both sides of the aisle are going to scream.

It is just the 8th time that the BBWAA has not voted anyone in, and the first time since 1996. Craig Biggio received the highest vote total, around 68% (75% is needed for election). Sammy Sosa got just 12.5%, which is actually a touch higher than I expected.

Despite the fact that, when you really consider the caliber of players available this year for votes, this is actually a loaded potential class, nobody is getting in. Because I’m still bitter about what happened to Ron Santo during his lifetime, in some ways, I struggle to care about this result.

UPDATE: Here’s the complete voting tally from the BBWAA:

2013 hall vote

  • Lone Ranger

    Barry Bonds is getting a higher percentage than expected

    • Four and Twenty

      I think that is due in large part to his Hall of Fame candidacy being very strong long before any ties to Victor Conte and BALCO. The man was a beast before he turned in to a beast.

  • http://thecubcontrarian.blogspot.com Kyle

    And the HOF moves another step closer to irrelevancy.

    • sclem21

      you dont like museums that practice revisionist history? weird. me either.

  • Jack Weiland

    Yawn.

  • @cubsfantroy

    I agree with Kyle on this one.

  • MichCubFan

    Aaron Sele got one vote. haha.

  • http://ehanauer.com clark addison

    The Hall of Fame needs to split into a real HOF and a Hall of Very Good.

    Can’t believe McGriff got more votes than Sosa.

    And who the hell is Aaron Sele? Some writer sending a message?

    • Jack Weiland

      Yes. And the message is “I’m a big dumb idiot, but I somehow convinced these people to let me be one of the gatekeepers of the Hall of Fame that very few people actually care about.”

      • cjdubbya

        I’d prefer to say that the message is “I really should not be voting for the Hall of Fame.” Seriously, a vote for Aaron Sele is a vote for you (not you, Jack, but rather the cops reporter that has a BBWAA vote) not having a clue.

    • Southern Cub

      I’m sorry but Fred McGriff should get more votes than Sammy (and should be in the HOF), never been linked to PED’s (just look at his frame). Take away the 94 strike and the man has 500+ HR’s, 2500+ H’s. His OPS and SLG%’s are as high as any current HOFer

      • Internet Random

        “never been linked to PED’s”

        Sweet. Me neither. Where my votes at?

        • Mike

          Where’s your OPS?

          • Internet Random

            Wait. You mean you want to look at relevant factors?

  • EQ76

    Not sure why I’m feeling a little defensive on Sosa, probably just that way for any Cub, but I’m not understanding why he’s much, much lower in votes than many of those guys ahead of him. yeah, maybe (probably, most likely, okay, definitely) he was a juicer, but he was one of the most dominant power guys of that generation. I guess I’m saying, he should get more respect out of all the cheaters. (wow, that sounded stupid).

    • Jim

      I think when you look back on Sosa’s career the highlights are marred by the PEDs era. Then you have the low lights: corked bat, alienation of teamates, leaving the last game of the season early, etc. These things are probably all still fresh in the voters minds. Maybe after a few years they will forget and start casting their votes his way. Also, the Cubs organization could help by bringing him back around as a face of the team. If the Cubs disrespect him, why shouldn’t the voters?

  • Drew7

    Pathetic.

    I can understand (though not necessarily agree with) not voting for Bonds and Clemens, but why not Piazza and Bagwell?

    What a joke.

    • beerhelps

      Not saying I agree with it, but there are plenty of suspicions about Piazza and Bagwell, too.

      • sclem21

        Not voting people in on suspicion is now something we are using as an argument. good griefffffffffffff.

      • Drew7

        Oh I understand that, but the only thing we *know* about Piazza is that he is, hands-down, the best hitting-catcher in the history of baseball. I just don’t see how you can “black-ball” an entire era.

  • Eric S

    Anyone else surprised about Lee Smith getting less than 50% of the vote? The guy was a dominant closer in his day and isn’t getting ANY love from the BBWAA.

    • Scotti

      Lee Smith should be in for sure. He terrified hitters.

  • EQ76

    Biggio should get in on all the HBP’s he took alone.

    • Scotti

      Except he used pillows. His padding was thicker than a catcher’s padding.

      • Mike

        Perhaps writers have trouble making distinction between pillows and pills?

  • MightyBear

    Absolutely ridiculous. I’m done.

  • Curt

    This is b.s. there has got to be a different way to do the voting just bc sportswriters and the general public are inclined to be angered like the steroid era players personally did something to them, how do you just ignore their stats , and I’ve heard statements that the hof is irrelevant while this might be true, the people voting have way to high of an opinion of themselves. this system is broken. And while ill agree some if these players are real douschenozzles, it shouldn’t affect the voting but it obviously does , and like Brett I will never look at the hof the same after the way santo was mistreated, screw the hof , the voters baseball continues to punch itself in the eye, and wonders why the nfl kicks baseballs ass everytime.itd be nice if selig would step in and fix the system and take it out the writers hands and make the voting impartial.

    • Scotti

      I’m no fan of Hall voters but the players DID “do something personally to them.” They lied. Repeatedly. And told them that their new found skills and abilities were from hard work, turning over a new leaf and maybe some good genes. And the writers (voters) wrote those stories. And some of them actually believed the players’ lies and spoke up for them. And now they look like fools to their readers because of these players’ lies. Now, I don’t believe revenge is a good reason to keep someone from the Hall (there are other good reasons) but the fact remains that these players DID do something personal to these writers.

      • Edwin

        It’s the writers job to cover the sport. If steroids were as common as most writers make it out to be, the writers should have known about it, but they did nothing. Either the writers were terrible at their jobs, or they turned a blind eye to what was going on.

        • Lou

          What about the owners? Look the profits they reaped from all of this as well. Blaming journalists in their entirety is convenient. But lets just excoriate the ones from the 90s while absolving the ones from the 70s and 80s who overlooked the fact that players were continuing the history of cheating by using such things as amphetamines. Nice.

  • http://weareworkers.com Skooter

    Look at this freakin’ class. Until we forgive Pete Rose, the HOF will continue to be a total joke.

    • Cyranojoe

      Yeah, I can’t understand Barry Bonds getting >30% of the HOF vote and Pete Rose being kept out because the dude like to play the ponies/bet on baseball. Anybody else not consider that remotely the same crime? One is literally cheating on baseball, the other is being addicted to baseball, idn’t it? In an era dominated by fantasy (i.e., betting on) sports, can the man who is STILL the owner of the MLB hits record 27 years after he retired get some dang love?

      • Drew7

        “…and Pete Rose being kept out because the dude like to play the ponies/bet on baseball. ”

        I’m fairly certain Rose was betting on baseball while he was managing, which is definitely a problem.

        • http://weareworkers.com Skooter

          It’s unfortunate. It’s unacceptable. It’s a problem, yes. However, there is abundant proof that he didn’t bet on his own team, like, ever, and it most DEFINITELY doesn’t invalidate what he did as a player.

          Hell, it’s common knowledge that freakin’ Willie Mays used amphetamines during his time, he was voted in with 94% of the vote!

          • http://thecubcontrarian.blogspot.com Kyle

            What proof, let alone abundant proof, exists that proves he didn’t bet against his own team? (which is what I assume you meant)

            • http://weareworkers.com Skooter

              Yeah, sorry that’s what I meant.

              I mean, the Dowd report clearly shows that he bet ON his own team 5-6 nights a week. In the report he levels accusations that Rose didn’t bet on the team when certain pitchers were starting, and that in fact he may have bet against the Reds while managing, but every piece of evidence in that report shows otherwise. The accusations have no teeth. The evidence that is out there supports Pete Rose’s case that he did bet for them but never against.

              • http://weareworkers.com Skooter

                Listen- at the end of the day, if you want to induct him with some kind of caveat excluding his managerial tenure, fine, but it’s impossible to deny what he did as a player and we all know that there are juicers and more already in the Hall. Congress stated in 1973 that the amount of steroid use in the MLB was “alarming.”

                It’s time we forgive Pete Rose.

              • http://thecubcontrarian.blogspot.com Kyle

                Evidence that he bet on his own teams is not evidence that he did not also bet against them. There is not some opposition between the two.

                • http://weareworkers.com Skooter

                  My point is there is abundant evidence that he bet ON his own team and only accusations with no evidence that he bet against. You can prove he bet on them, you can’t prove he bet against.

                  Again- maybe his tenure as a manager should be ineligible, but as a player he clearly played his heart out. That deserves to be in the HOF. Dammit. I mean, what is the argument against him being inducted as a player? That he could have been MORE amazing? I find it impossible to believe that he left anything on the field.

                  • Internet Random

                    I can’t prove that invisible leprechauns don’t live in my attic either.

                    As a general rule, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence… especially when there’s incentive to conceal evidence.

                    • DarthHater

                      There is no affirmative evidence that invisible leprechauns live in your attic and hence no rational basis for believing in their existence. Similarly, there is no affirmative evidence that Rose bet against his own team and hence no rational basis for believing that he did so.

                      Conversely, if you believe that it’s okay to simply accept all accusations against Rose because he would have an incentive to conceal evidence, then you presumably also believe it’s okay to believe all accusations about PED use by players – even in the absence of any affirmative evidence – because they, too would have an incentive to conceal such evidence.

                    • Internet Random

                      “There is no affirmative evidence that invisible leprechauns live in your attic . . . .”

                      Yes, there is. My neighbors say that they have seen them. In legal parlance, that’s what’s known as direct evidence.

                      “Similarly, there is no affirmative evidence that Rose bet against his own team and hence no rational basis for believing that he did so.”

                      This is just plain wrong. John M. Dowd, the man who was responsible for conducting the investigation of Rose’s gambling habits, thinks Rose bet against the Reds while he managed them. “He said his investigation was “close” to showing that Rose also bet against the Reds, but that time constraints prevented its inclusion in the report.” [http://static.espn.go.com/mlb/news/2002/1212/1475769.html] That’s evidence. It might not be as good as a video recording of Rose making bets against the Reds, but evidence it most certainly is.

                      “Conversely, if you believe that it’s okay to simply accept all accusations against Rose because he would have an incentive to conceal evidence, then you presumably also believe it’s okay to believe all accusations about PED use by players – even in the absence of any affirmative evidence – because they, too would have an incentive to conceal such evidence.”

                      Fun… but not responsive to what I said. Please pay attention, because here it is again: “As a general rule, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence… especially when there’s incentive to conceal evidence.”

                    • Internet Random

                      I don’t know why it truncated my link, but here’s another attempt:

                      http://static.espn.go.com/mlb/news/2002/1212/1475769.html

                  • http://thecubcontrarian.blogspot.com Kyle

                    The argument is that he agreed to it. And his days as a player and a manager were not separate.

                    I don’t care if he’s in or not, but the passionate defense befuddles me.

                    • DarthHater

                      In 1989, Rose voluntarily accepted a permanent place on baseball’s ineligible list. It was not until 1991 that the Hall of Fame formally voted to exclude individuals on the permanently ineligible list from induction. So, at the time of the agreement, he was not necessarily agreeing to anything regarding the HOF.

                      As for passionate defense, I don’t personally give a rat’s ass, but I do think it’s kinda stupid for the all-time hits leader not to be in the HOF. You can say the same for the all-time HR leader, as far as I’m concerned.

                    • http://weareworkers.com Skooter

                      This…except I do kind of give a rats ass.

                      “In 1989, Rose voluntarily accepted a permanent place on baseball’s ineligible list. It was not until 1991 that the Hall of Fame formally voted to exclude individuals on the permanently ineligible list from induction. So, at the time of the agreement, he was not necessarily agreeing to anything regarding the HOF.

                      As for passionate defense, I don’t personally give a rat’s ass, but I do think it’s kinda stupid for the all-time hits leader not to be in the HOF. You can say the same for the all-time HR leader, as far as I’m concerned.”

      • http://thecubcontrarian.blogspot.com Kyle

        PEDs are classified under the type of crime where a player is trying too hard to help his team win.

        Betting on games involving your own team calls into question whether you are trying to win at all.

        The latter will always be judged more harshly in baseball terms.

        • Boogens

          I think that it’s more likely that players took/still take PEDs more for personal or selfish reasons than trying too hard to help their teams win.

        • DarthHater

          “PEDs are classified under the type of crime where a player is trying too hard to help his team win.”

          And you’ll find that classification of crime in the rulebook chapter titled: “Kyle’s Imagination.”

          • http://thecubcontrarian.blogspot.com Kyle

            My views on this matter were largely shaped by the writings of George Will.

    • hansman1982

      Well then:

      Until we forgive Shoeless Joe Jackson, the HOF will continue to be a total joke.

      Wait, him and Rose are on bans until everyone forgets about them. Rose agreed to the ban…

  • http://www.viewfromthebleachers.com Norm

    Poor Kenny Lofton. Going the way of Lou Whitaker instead of Jack Morris

  • swaz46

    The biggest problem with this, in my opinion, is the fact that several votes are held by people who haven’t covered baseball in years. The Tribune’s Olympics writer has a Hall of Fame vote, for God’s sake. It’s a joke. Craig Biggio had 3,000 hits, and yet he’s not qualified? Screw these guys.

  • http://Bleachernation Jay

    The Aaron Sele vote was the only vote on that ballot. Five ballots were completely blank as well. This was an opportunity for the voters to make a statement regarding the PED era by voting in a Dale Murphy, Lee Smith, &/or Jack Morris. Disappointed as usual in HOF voting. I agree, Brett, lost total respect in the process with the Santo election.

  • Edward

    Anybody else having issues like this the past few days? Page keeps locking up on me.

    A script on this page may be busy, or it may have stopped responding. You can stop the script now, or you can continue to see if the script will complete.

    Script: http://b.voicefive.com/c2/14576392/rs.js#c1=3&c3=262217&c4=12251563&c5=5993823&c6=&c10=1&c11=Google%20Display%20Network%20US&c12=&c13=300×250&c16=mm&ax_i=&ax_g=&ax_nobl=1&:1

    • http://www.bleachernation.com Brett

      Sorry, Edward. Sounds like a busted ad script – unfortunately not everyone sees the same ads (and broken ones aren’t always broken for every browser/version/etc.). I’ll look into this one and try to get it shut down. In the interim, it’s ok if you kill that script. Again, sorry about the pain.

      • calicubsfan007

        @Brett: Speaking of busted script, this page keeps freezing.

  • Dustin S

    Setting the steroid debate aside for a second, I would really love to see Lee Smith get in there. When I was young I helped my dad in his business doing home renovation, and I’ll never forget listening to every Cub game on the radio while we worked back in the early-mid 80s. If you are a bit younger and missed him, I’ll just say that it was sure nice have a complete shutdown closer where you knew the game was basically over when he came in. He walked some guys, but rarely blew a save. I had to go back and glance at his stats, but almost 500 saves, 7 time All-Star, top 5 CY voting 3 times, 18 years in the pros…and no steroid questions on him. I suppose he’s borderline and closers are always a tough call, but even taking the Cubs fan glasses off for a minute, he’s a guy who had success for a long time for a lot of different teams in his career. If the voters are not going to seriously consider the juice guys for awhile, it makes the field pretty thin this year and I’m surprised he didn’t get in or at least closer than he got.

    Likewise, I would put Jack Morris in the same boat. Check out his stats line sometime, the guy had an absolutely insane IP year after year. He never had an ERA under 3 which hurts, but most of his career was in the old Tiger Stadium bandbox where it was only 315 ft to rf.

  • ssckelley

    I doubt anyone on this list gets in next year either, there is a pretty good of first timers eligible next year.

    • Spriggs

      Maddux, Thomas, Glavine should all be voted in first ballot next year.

      • hansman1982

        If Maddux doesn’t get 1st ballot, noone ever will.

  • calicubsfan007

    For the love of God, this is another reason why we need to rework the HOF voting. I hate that it is controlled by idiots. Stupid media.

  • Forlines

    The treatment of Santo was outrageous enough, so I don’t know why i’m surprised, but no Mattingly, Trammell, or Morris!?!?! The hof is a damn joke, and I don’t see any change.

    btw, first time poster. Shout-out to Brett T. B. Nation is my favorite place to get my Cubbies updates

    • http://www.bleachernation.com Brett

      Thanks and welcome, Forlines.

    • calicubsfan007

      Hey Forlines, welcome. (=

  • Spriggs

    Give me these guys. In their primes — juiced or gambling or clean — it would be a heck of a lineup, wouldn’t it?

    Tim Raines (OF)
    Pete Rose (2B*)
    Joe Jackson (OF)
    Barry Bonds (OF)
    Mark McGwire (1B)
    Sammy Sosa (DH)
    Mike Piazza (C)
    Jeff Bagwell (3B**)
    Alan Trammell (SS)

    Roger Clemens (SP)
    Lee Smith (RP)

    *Rose did start his carreer at 2nd and **Bagwell played 3rd almost all of his minor league career… kind of a stretch there, I know. I hope Trammell doesn’t develop any bad habits around these guys…

    • SirCub

      You’d win a LOT of games…

      • Rmoody100

        with Clemens pitching every day having only one relief pitcher?

        • DarthHater

          That’s okay. There are drugs that can help with that.

      • Internet Random

        Yeah, like .750.

  • 5412

    Hi,

    As an old Cub fan, I don’t think Sammy belongs in the HOF, with or without steroids. He was not a team player, nor was he a smart player. He threw to the wrong base so often it was amazing.

    He was nothing but a guy trying to hit home runs. Good pitchers were not afraid of him because they knew if they were careful, more often than not they could strike him out…..as evidenced by his post season performance.

    On a personal basis, the guy had a fourth grade education and was shining shoes before he got his baseball shot. Somtimes we forget not all of these guys are educated or smart for that matter.

    And finally, I was personally insulted with his “No speaka de english” performance in front of congress. Sammy we are not that stupid.

    regards,
    5412

    • JB88

      What the hell does his education have to do with anything? Racist mucho?

    • Spriggs

      With all due respect, I don’t really care how smart Sammy might have been. You say with or without steroids — well in that regard, he put up numbers that are absolutely HOF worthy. 610 homers. Just look at the ten year span of offensive superstardom.

      So what if he swung for the fences? Mickey Mantle said he tried to hit a home run every single time he batted. He’s not leaving Cooperstown any time soon.

      • Cedlandrum

        Also to say he only swung for the fences is revisionist history. During the big homer years that is true, but he also had some pretty good years throwing guys out on the bags.

        For some fun if you haven’t in a while go look at Sammy’s numbers the 5 years before the big one in 98. He was a better player then most remember.

        • Cedlandrum

          I meant to say swiping some bags too. He was flawed but pretty good.

    • hansman1982

      Let’s teach you spanish as a 2nd language and then throw you in front of the Mexican congress to testify (under oath) while all of Latin America hangs on every word you say and see how quick you will bust out your spanish.

      • Internet Random

        +1

  • JB88

    Sanctimonious and pathetic. Those are really the only words I have for these voting results. The writers were absolutely complicit in the steroid scandal, did nothing to report it for nearly a decade, had the stories literally fall into their lap and still underreported it, and now act all high and mighty from electing people into the HOF for, get this, something that wasn’t even prohibited in baseball until a point in time after which these men were using the roids! Get that, punished by history for things that weren’t even illegal at the time they did it.

    I think Clemens and Bonds are probably the two biggest douches that I have ever watched in any game and even I believe they are first ballot HOF’ers. Just a joke and a travesty. And I’m not even that mad about the vote, but more about the fact that a bunch of f’ing hypocrites are the gatekeepers of what used to be the most hallowed of the Halls.

    • Forlines

      Seems to be the way of the world. Doesn’t matter if it’s Baseball or Church, folks love the chance to lord something over you…

    • rhino70

      THIS!

      The Baseball Writers stood idly by while all this went on and didn’t do jack, yet they play judge, jury and executioner in the HOF voting process.

  • Featherstone

    Grab your pitchforks and torches, but I am actually mostly ok with this result.

    I am very much in favor of a small HoF and other than really Craig Biggio and probably Mike Piazza, I dont think most people deserve to get in THIS YEAR.

    I think some of these people will get in eventually and some may have to be posthumously inducted but they will get in.

  • http://ehanauer.com clark addison

    Lots of revisionist history here. Who among us that followed baseball in 1998 wasn’t captivated by the home run race?

    Sure, lots of hitters and pitchers were juiced in that era, but how many of them had three 60 home run seasons? How many of them had 9 straight years of 100+ rbi’s including a four year stretch when he ranged from 138 to 160 rbis per year?

    If Sosa developed an exaggerated sense of his importance, the Cubs, the press, and we fans were certainly enablers.

    Current Cubs management has done him no favors by keeping him on the outside in pariah status, after the previous regime raked in millions of dollars selling him to us. It’s time for the Cubs to reconcile and recognize him.

  • blublud

    Brett, this is completely off the subject of this post, but I’m writing a report on hitters and the effect that the count has on the AB, which I would like to share when it’s complete. Curious tidbit though on the 2nd pitch of an at-bat though. Hitters have the most success in baseball when putting the 2nd pitch in play. It doesn’t matter if the count is 1-0 or 0-1. I looked at the 6 most impact(if you wanna call them that) hitters we had in our lineups last season and all of their numbers, with exception of Dejesus batting average(There is always exceptions to the norm. His slugging and OPS were higher), supports the theory. Here are those numbers.

    the lines are laid out in AB H AVE SLG OPS

    LaHair 39 16 .410 .769 1.179

    Barney 151 42 .278 .384 .662

    Dejesus 103 26 .252 .553 .805

    Soriano 97 41 .422 .793 1.215

    Rizzo 73 32 .438 .904 1.342

    Castro 121 42 .347 .504 .851

    I also look at some other players in the report and cam up with

    Cabrera 133 44 .389 1.009 1.398

    Trout 93 35 .376 .870 1.246

    Fielder 98 33 .336 .602 .932(OPS lower then season total)

    Posey 67 32 .478 .925 1.403

    Braun 94 37 .394 .827 1.222

    McCutchen 100 50 .500 .840 1.340

    It covers other Cubs players as well as other non-Cubs players. It’s not a comparision of player to player, but a rather, individual players counts vs each other. I just wanted to state this with us talking about BJax and rather he is to patient or not, and the organization pushing patience at the plate in the minor leagues now. The write-up will be pretty interesting. It covers much more then just the 2nd pitch. It addressess if being to selective can actually hurt you chances at success in any giving at-bat.

    • blublud

      Let me add that there are other counts for each individual hitter that their numbers may be better then the 2 pitch, but they vary by hitter. The 2nd pitch however, was better for every hitter that I looked at.

  • Rob

    Aaron Sele, aside from being AARON SELE, finished his career with a 4.61 ERA and 1.49 WHIP, Baseball Reference lists some his best “comps” as Mike Hampton, Scott Erickson, Freddy Garcia, Woody Williams and Pedro Astacio. Please say they make all HOF votes public, so the writer that cast this ballot can be banned???

  • Roughrider

    “Because I’m still bitter about what happened to Ron Santo during his lifetime, in some ways, I struggle to care about this result.”

    In many ways, me too. !!!

    Maybe they thought insulin was a PED.

    • MichiganGoat

      If the BBWA doesn’t seriously make some changes the HOF is looking less and less valid everytime to FUBAR the ballot like this.

  • MichiganGoat

    This is Bullshit how can a 3000 hit member not be a fist ballot HOF the writers should be ashamed for all this. Talk about tarnishing the hall this is shameful.

Bleacher Nation Privacy Policy and Terms of Use. Bleacher Nation is a private media site, and it is not affiliated in any way with Major League Baseball or the Chicago Cubs. Neither MLB nor the Chicago Cubs have endorsed, supported, directed, or participated in the creation of the content at this site, or in the creation of the site itself. It's just a media site that happens to cover the Chicago Cubs.

Bleacher Nation is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.

Google+