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matt garza cubsFor a combination of reasons, the prevailing wisdom these days is that, if the Chicago Cubs trade Matt Garza, it’ll be well in advance of the July 31 non-waiver Trade Deadline. Garza’s value is enormous right now, and the Cubs were burned last year by an ill-time injury because they took the Garza shopping quest deep into late July. Well, that’s the narrative on trading Garza sooner rather than later, anyway.

But, as Keith Law told me and Sahadev on the BN Podcast this week, the Cubs are likely to have already decided on a price they would accept for Garza – a very high price – and will be content to sit back and wait on a team to meet that huge price. If true, the Cubs may well have to risk injury (or ineffectiveness, but I tend to think that Garza’s performance is such a known quantity at this point that only injury could truly derail his trade value) in order to get their required price. In other words, the Cubs might have to take thing much deeper into July than our hearts may prefer.

That possibility was further supported on today’s iteration of Buster Olney’s Baseball Tonight podcast, in which the eponymous Olney spoke with his colleague, Jayson Stark.

After noting that talent evaluators are telling Olney that Garza looks every bit as good as his numbers say he should look, Olney said that his sense is that the Cubs will move Garza soon. He believes the Cubs are motivated to move Garza as soon as possible so that they make sure to get some real value for him, rather than risking injury. Indeed, Olney said he would be “shocked” if Garza was still with the Cubs after the All-Star break.

But Stark quickly responded that he was hearing the opposite. Although the Cubs are ready and willing to move players at any time, in Garza’s case, Stark says the Cubs know they’ve got the best available pitcher. For that reason, “they’re willing to wait for their price” (echoing what Law said). And, according to the teams Stark has spoken to, that price is going to be significant – Stark described it as “the highest,” which he essentially described as the highest of all players – hitter or pitcher – available on the market. (I’d note only that it’s conceivable that if a – just as an example – premier non-rental player like Chase Headley came on the market, Garza would no longer have the highest asking price.)

That all said, Stark says that there is still some caution out there from inquiring teams, based on Garza’s recent injury history and his up-and-down career. Couple that with the Cubs’ asking price, and Stark thinks Garza is going to be on the market for a long while yet.

In saying so, Stark summed up what is so simultaneously wonderful and frustrating about this time of year. Olney and Stark are colleagues who work in the same area, and who each have excellent sources. They are hearing precisely opposite things about the timing of a Garza move.

What’s the truth? Well, I could say that only the Cubs know … but maybe they don’t even know. It seems logical to me that, yes, they’d like to move him as quickly as possible. But they’ll also move him only when a team meets their price. In that way, the conflicting inputs are both true, and the market will ultimately dictate how long Garza remains a Cub.

  • nkniacc13

    they set a price don’t drop it until the deadline. Get all you can get Theo/Jed

  • nkniacc13

    Brett, Don’t you think that this Garza trade could very well tell us fans what the FO sees as far as how soon they think they will be ready to compete?

    • http://www.bleachernation.com Brett

      You mean in terms of the return? Maybe. But remember: assets are assets, and can be spun into other things as needed.

      So I guess the answer is mostly no.

      • nkniacc13

        Yes brett, I was talking in terms or return. What I kinda thought was if they get high upside but low minor leaguers then it may push back the date they were targeting or if they get a couple of prospects that could play next year maybe they see them a lot closer to competting

        • http://www.bleachernation.com Brett

          For me, there’s no data there. Getting low level high upside guys is just about getting the best assets possible. Those could be kept or spun for big leaguers. Doesn’t really tell us much.

          • nkniacc13

            ok that’s what I wondered. Plus like you said they can always be moved for MLB players

  • sven-erik312

    They should keep him. Garza, Samarjiza and Wood will be a great line up. Then all we need to do is wait for a good relief staff and we got it!

  • Tobias

    The only problem that I see on waiting until the deadline is that more teams could drop out of contention and could start selling. A team like San Diego could go on a losing streak which would have them not acquiring someone like Garza.

    • Me

      They already are. San Diego will be sellers I believe

    • http://www.bleachernation.com Brett

      That thinking presumes that those very teams are, themselves, not yet willing to make a trade until they see if they fall out of it.

      You can’t force a buyer to buy just because you’re ready to sell.

  • http://deepcenterfield.blogspot.com Jason Powers

    The series coming up, LA v. SF, Col v. AZ will determine a lot. Splits will keep them in the market. Sweeps with narrow down. Texas looking for SP definitely means a better catch of prospects, and competition against those NL West guys.

    After Garza’s dominate Oakland performance, able to hit 94 on his four seamer in the 8th, that impressed, or confirmed his health. (He just needs to stay away from back to back curves…game mgmt. there.)

  • @cubsfantroy

    Isn’t that what happened last year? They waited and waited and then Garza got hurt. I hope it doesn’t happen this way. They should strike while the iron is hot, a couple of more starts isn’t going to turn a team one way or the other.

    • http://www.bleachernation.com Brett

      It’s not about hoping good starts turn the tide. It’s about waiting out the market. Teams may not yet be ready to bid strongly until they see what happens over the next couple of weeks.

      • @cubsfantroy

        Gotcha, I read it wrong. Sorry. I took it as trying to get his value up.

  • CubbieKaryn

    Wouldn’t we be better off giving him a qualifying offer at the end of the season and hope he’ll either stick around for 1 year or we get a draft pick as compensation. If we plan on contending next year (which most signs are saying we will), I think we should let him stick around!

    Otherwise, I agree that we should be blown away by a deal for him. I just don’t see us getting a huge return since he is purely a rental solution and becomes a free agent at the end of the year. However, it does help Garza’s value if he’s traded, because then he’s not tied to draft pick compensation at the end of the season.

    • Chad

      I would say that most signs are telling us no as far as contending next year, but that is just me perhaps. I say no, it is not worth it, because Garza is not going to accept that offer. Thus the best the cubs can get is a draft pick. Garza’s trade value is worth much more than a draft pick and could net us something closer to a ML ready pitcher perhaps. The cubs actually have a better shot of getting Garza back if they actually wanted to do that if they traded him and then signed him as a FA.

      However, I believe that is common thought that Garza will return a player that should be controlled much longer, cheaper and of equal talent (eventually) as Garza currently is to the cubs rotation.

  • Cast

    Garza and Schierholtz for Profar and a solid arm in the minor league system from Texas

    • http://bleachernation.com someday…2015?

      It would take Samardzija to get Texas to even consider a trade of Profar.

    • Rebuilding

      You would be lucky to get Profar in a Samardzija deal

      • http://bleachernation.com someday…2015?

        Exactly.

        • Cast

          Yes I know. That’s just me wishing for something that won’t happen.

    • Stevie B

      Garza for Bundy straight up. Who hangs up first?

      • Die hard

        Garza for Brandy straight up with an Utley Chaser in a non porno 3 way

  • Me

    Trade Samardzija and Garza for the future. If they are expecting to compete in 2017 them Jeff will be 32 even if we start in 2015 he will be 30. That’s starting to get up in age

    • On The Farm

      Cliff Lee didn’t become a dominate starter until he was 30 in 2008 and I think he is doing alright…

      • Me

        32 is when players start to exit their prime years. It’s risky that’s the problem

        • YourResidentJag

          Yep, I think that, if Bradley was packaged with other prospects from AZ for Shark, the Cubs would seriously have to consider that offer. It’s the perfect confluence of factors that may or may not come up again this season. A playoff contending team with a deep farm consisting of high level SP prospects. That’s not to say there aren’t those in the offseason, but the NL West is a winnable division for AZ. The Diamondbacks certainly need more SP, with the down season of Cahill and Miley not exactly lighting it up this season.

          • Crockett

            They would definitely consider it. But I guarantee that Towers was trying to get Shark without giving up Bradley OR Skaggs.

            • Chad

              If the cubs could trade Samardzija for Profar you have to do it. I think then you could trade Castro for SP prospects if you wanted to, or move him to 2B even. I would rather have a Profar type player that is good at defense and ok at offense (can’t be worse than Castro) at SS. Castro could be better at 2nd or bring home a heck of a lot of prospects or even a guy like David Price etc. Just sayin. Also Shark will be a FA after 2015. If the cubs do compete in 2015, then they just get one year of Shark until they either pay him or he leaves.

              • Rebuilding

                There is no player on our roster or in the minors that we wouldn’t trade for Profar

                • Chad

                  I do not disagree at all with that.

                  • Rich H

                    I think that Baez for Profar would be the only starting point that Texas would want to discuss and that would not be strait up.

            • YourResidentJag

              Sure. Yep I’m sure he is. But does he want to win a winnable division? I guess I’d have to ask him that.

  • http://deepcenterfield.blogspot.com Jason Powers

    Since Nelson Cruz is under a biogenesis cloud, and David Murphy is a FA too, Scheirholtz would be a cheap option for them. They’ll be active for FA OF since they don’t currently have a MLB ready prospect (Martin having been called up). But would Scheirholtz & Garza garner what the Cubs want back?

    Texas has both C AJ and Soto going to FA too. So, like us, they’ll be wanting a proven option for their staff. (Or a resign…)

    Could be a partner – Profar is unlikely going anywhere but a Texas Longhorns game. Texas could not take the PR hit…It would be like Starlin Castro moving circa 2012.

  • John

    I believe texas would trade profar for samardzjia. With Beltre, kinsler, and Andrus already in there infield i do think they would make that deal.

  • Ivy Walls

    Cubs will sit and wait till they get the price they mapped out, A top 20 prospect or two top 50 or three top 100 or combo ;

    Trading partners with top 100 prospect list that makes sense

    AZ Skaggs (LHP in AAA) or Bradley RHP or Davidson 3B AAA, AA and/or Owens SS AAA,
    Pitt, Taillon RHP AA & Heredia RHP A,
    TEX Olt 3B AAA & Buckel RHP or Alfaro C A,
    BOS Bradley OF AAA & Barnes RHP or Webster RHP or Owens LHP A+,
    SD Fried LHP A & Kelly RHP AA or Hedges C A+,

    Matching up other contenders with prospects doesn’t wash, AZ and SD are interesting but look for Boston and Tex as well. Doubt Pitt gets involved but their thirst and having Garza on the top could have them begin to bite. Cardinals could also enter the picture late if they feel they are short an arm

    STL Taveras OF AAA or Martinez RHP AAA & Wacha RHP AAA

    The other suitors could be Det (if there is an injury or thirst to go over the top) and Baltimore again if injury and thirst

    Det Castelannos OF AAA & Rondon RHP
    Balt Gausmann RHP AAA & Shoop 2B AA,

    The only other contender that has players is Oakland and Beane is not that kind of dealer

    • On The Farm

      “AZ Skaggs (LHP in AAA) or Bradley RHP or Davidson 3B AAA, AA and/or Owens SS AAA,”
      Maybe Skaggs, as he seems to be the only player they want to move in any deal. If the Cubs make a deal with this team it will have to be for one of their SP.

      “AAA,Pitt, Taillon RHP AA & Heredia RHP A,”
      Seems a bit like shooting the moon, Tallion is a stud.

      “TEX Olt 3B AAA & Buckel RHP or Alfaro C A,”
      Could happen, probably need more than Garza for this haul

      “BOS Bradley OF AAA & Barnes RHP or Webster RHP or Owens LHP A+”
      Yes please to any of those pitchers, that’s an easy win for the FO.

      “SD Fried LHP A & Kelly RHP AA or Hedges C A+”
      SD would have to still be in contention which is begining to look real suspect at this point. Further I don’t think you would land two of these three. Best bet here is one and another solid piece. Didn’t Kelly just have some TJ surgery, fits the MO.

      “STL Taveras OF AAA or Martinez RHP AAA & Wacha RHP AAA”
      Keep dreaming on any of these players, not too mention STL can turn any scrub pitcher into gold on a whim.

      “Det Castelannos OF AAA & Rondon RHP”
      Need a lot more than Garza to pry these guys. Smyly or Porcello might be better routes to go anyway.

      “Balt Gausmann RHP AAA & Shoop 2B AA”
      Baltimore wanted Garza orginally, the FO must have realized they weren’t going to be able to get Gausmann which is probably why they dealt Feldman there.

      • X the Cubs Fan

        He was talking about Samardzija.

    • YourResidentJag

      You forgot about Toronto.

    • Stevie B

      Ooooooo…I want Buckel……

    • Rebuilding

      The only one of your proposed trades that wouldn’t cause the other team to hang up the phone immediately is the Texas one. And that’s because Olt is batting under .200 and has vision problems due to one of his tear ducts not working and Buckel has walked 28 guys in 9 innings (he’s suffering from Rick Ankiel syndrome)

  • John (ibcnu2222)

    How about Garza and Nate for Neftali Feliz, Olt, and Luke Jackson? Is this too much, too little, or just right?

    • Ivy Walls

      don’t thin Schierholtz is on the block.

      • On The Farm

        He is for the right package of players

    • Rich H

      Everyone seems to think that a trade with Texas would be just prospects. I am not sure that we would not go for an everyday player so they can open up a spot for Profar.

      • nkniacc13

        there isn’t a position that Profar plays that the Cubs would want to take. I could see a 3 team deal that would allow Texas to do that but the spot they open wont be going to cubs

      • Rebuilding

        The only way I could see that playing out is if someone wanted Kinsler and that team then sent us prospects. Not impossible I guess

        • Rich H

          That is kind of where my mind was at. We do a trade for Kisler if we trade Barney or just flip Kinsler either or. We need offense that is major league ready almost as much as we need pitching. So a trade like that would not surprise me at all.

          • Serious Cubs Fan

            Kinsler is an 31 and aging. Makes no sense to acquire him bc he makes a ton of money and will be 34-35 by the time were competing. I really like kinsler but his age and contract don’t align with the cubs time frame of competing

            • mudge

              FO should focus on the non-aging 31 year olds.

            • Rich H

              You have a point. I probably am trying to hard to think outside of the box. Texas needs to open up a spot for Profar. They may wait to see if injuries open something up for him. I would not be a bit surprised if Kinsler ends up traded to open up that spot. I would say Moreland and put Kinsler in left but I just do not see much market for a FA to be that really has never stuck in the line up.

              • Rich H

                Was thinking Murphy and typed Moreland but you all know that already.

    • Crockett

      That actually sounds pretty good, but if Feliz is destined for the pen (which I think he is), then I think the Cubs decline.

  • caryatid62

    I’m just excited for the Garza trade to happen so people can take time off from whining about how Castro doesn’t hustle and spend some quality time whining about how the Cubs got screwed on a Garza deal.

  • Jono

    Isn’t there value to rental for a team looking for a multi year deal? That team gets first dibs at negotiating that long term contract. The player doesn’t take on the risk of reducing his value between now and free agency. So signing a rental like garza has more value than just the rest of 2013, the team gets a pretty good shot at an extension, too. And im sure its not impossible for the buying team to find out if the player would be interested in playing with that team long term

  • Guy S.

    So here’s how I understand it:

    Cubs original draft pool was $4,557,200, which they are allowed to increase by no more than 50% through slot acquisitions.

    This allows us a MAXIMUM pool of $6,835,800 (with a 5% cushion)

    We have acquired and dealt a few slots totaling $5,520,300.

    Cubs have signed Torres, Moreno, Mejia & Matos for approx. $3,620,000, and have reportedly agreed to signing Jimenez for $2.8 M, which puts us at a total of $6,420,000 owed.

    So in order to stay in the black. we must acquire $415,800 in draft pool slots, give or take a few thousand $, due to the 5% cushion.

    I’m no accountant (I am) but I’d just like to know if I’m on, or in the vicinity of, the right track.

    • Jono

      Bretts recent article about the over-budget strategy is sound, but I don’t see why they couldn’t just trade for that little extra pool money and have even more options for next year. It shouldn’t take much to get that amount of international pool money. Trading away international slots seems fine, but why limit your options when getting that $400k should be pretty painless?

      • Guy S.

        yea, I read the article and listened to the podcasts and agree with you. I understand the reasons for just “taking our lumps” and incurring tax penalties, but i think it to be much more sensible to just get an extra $400K in slots and avoid penalties altogether. The only issue is that we must acquire the extra slot money BEFORE we go over our draft pool allotment by signing Jimenez. Hendry/Hoyer understand what they’re doing better than any of us so I have confidence in whatever decision they make.

  • YourResidentJag

    Per Cubs Den and Baltimore media, Garza would have already been traded to Baltimore but Orioles didn’t want to part with prospects like Schoop.

    • Ivy Walls

      as said if injury or thirst increases over the month

      • On The Farm

        I would have to think Arizona or Texas would be the thirty-est. Its so dang hot there!

        • Ivy Walls

          hot here too in CO Springs…

          TEX makes most sense

          • Crockett

            Texas (or Boston) is the dream trading partner.

            If Boston loses another starter in the next 7-10 days, things could get VERY interesting.

            • On The Farm

              PLEASE BOSTON, THEO ISNT DONE ROBBING ALL OF YOUR TALENT!

            • On The Farm

              But seriously I want this Boston thing to happen

  • Ivy Walls

    Watch for the Cubs and Francoeur’s DFA release Cubs could trade Hairston and save KC $`1.2M but Cubs would get out of Hairston next year and have a better RF’er

    • DocPeterWimsey

      The only player in baseball worse than Franceour is Yuniesky Betancourt. Why it took Moore so long to figure that out baffles me.

    • Die hard

      Have to find Hairston first–last sight was doing the weather forecasts while still tethered to the New Mexico weather balloon

      • Cyranojoe

        Entertaining, seeing how Hairston just smacked a two-run homer minutes ago…

        • Die hard

          So they found him? Miracles never cease!

  • mudge

    There goes Shark’s trade value. Suicidal.

  • Timmy

    BREAKING NEWS: Garza traded for Carlos Marmol

    • Crockett

      Can you go away? Take Die Hard with you? Mmmmkay?

      • TWC

        SHOCK: Timmy lied about leaving and never coming back.

  • George

    Last year when the Brewers traded Greinke, they received 3 players. And Segura, within a year, has turned into an All Star. Arguably one of the top couple of ss in the league. I hope the Cubs can do the same.

  • Timmy

    BREAKING NEWS: Crockett traded for Carlos Marmol

  • Serious Cubs Fan

    Toronto/Garza rumor: Kyle Drabek as a center piece or part of a deal for Garza. I would be pretty disappoint if Drabek is the centerpiece. This would be like the Feldman deal. Take a chance on another teams former top prospects that have haven’t workout in the major, but they still have good stuff. I’m really hoping for some prospects and not a reclamation project in a Garza trade.

    • Jp3

      Meh, that deal sounds great!…2 years ago.

    • nkniacc13

      I don’t mind 1 reclamation project but not as the center piece of the best SP chip out there

      • Serious Cubs Fan

        I completely agree, the deal is rumored to be discussing a deal of Drabek, Sean Nolin LHP, and a 3rd prospect. Drabek is reclamation project with good stuff and quite a bit of injury history. Sean Nolin a top 10 prospect but very…meh prospect in terms of what you hope for in a Garza deal, not great stuff but he’s having a nice year. Nolin certainly is a legit prospect but nothing to get excited about.

        • Rebuilding

          Hopefully that is Toronto wishful thinking. That return would be very disappointing

          • YourResidentJag

            Well, seeing tonights game against the Twins, the Jays have been in a tailspin. The more I think about it, the more I think Red Sox. They need someone to replace Dubront in the rotation and haven’t been enamored with him since he came into spring training overweight.

    • Dumpgobbler

      I would have to think a guy like Sanchez or Osuna would also be in the deal. Drabek as the center piece is just termed that way because hes the most known player.

      • YourResidentJag

        I would think Osuna would have to be, or I don’t do that deal.

      • Serious Cubs Fan

        If we could get Sanchez, would be ecstatic, because that kid is a flat out stud. I doubt we could get him in Garza deal bc he’s a rental. But maybe. you never know, bc Garza pitching amazing right now and maybe a little bidding war between Boston and Toronto could happen. Garza’s a difference maker in a division and in the playoffs

        • Rebuilding

          Sanchez has electric stuff no doubt. He really has some control issues though. He would be high risk/high reward. The Jays are all in so who knows, but I doubt they would let him go after trading Syndergaard

        • Dumpgobbler

          Good post. Sanchez, along with guys like Skaggs, Bradley, Taillon / Cole, Sanchez, Barnes.. I just dont see us getting that level of talent for Garza. I see guys like Crick, Lee, Osuna, Owens, Perez / Jackson, Heredia.. Those are the level arms I think are obtainable for Garza.. If I had to guess.

          • Rebuilding

            I think your guess is right

            • Crockett

              And really, I am fine with almost all of those names. And realistically, if any packages involving them are being offered right now, I’d like to see them pull the trigger. This waiting around worries me.

  • Timmy

    BREAKING NEWS: TWC reads the Drudgereport

  • dumbledoresacubsfan

    Brett, have you heard anything about any interest on Garza out of the Athletic’s camp? Just wondering if Gray would be a possible trade piece. I doubt they’d let go of him, but I played with him in high school, so that would be pretty cool.

    • Rebuilding

      I think Sonny Gray makes a lot of sense on both sides

      • dumbledoresacubsfan

        The Cubs drafted him out of high school after he told teams he was going to college, so I was kind of bummed when we let him slide in the ’11 draft.

        He’s pitching extremely well in AAA this year and is supposed to be starting the PCL All Star game, I believe.

        I think he let the money and freedom get to his head last year, but being in AAA seems to have straightened him out.

  • Die hard

    If Cubs trade Garza that says they don’t expect to compete for 5 yrs… Doesn’t anybody else realize that to do this frees up Castro as trade bait

    • Drew7

      Right – trying to get something of value for a guy set to be a FA next year is *definitely* punting until 2019.

    • Timmy

      this is true because Theo has announced it several times and the current rebuild has failed so poorly. castro is gone as soon as they can move him. and don’t be surprised if rizzo is next while his stock is still high.

      they realize they didn’t appropriately protect these guys in the lineup and left them for sitting ducks to older pitchers. they dropped the ball on their development so they’ll get rid of them and try a new wave.

      • Carew

        How has it failed

        • Timmy

          how hasn’t it? look at our record, batting averages, lineup, etc. these guys were left flailing when they needed help, and the rebuild was reset by a year or two. it’ll be 6-7 years from when theo took over until we even begin to compete. kids will have completed an entire college career and gotten married before we’re 500.

          • Jed Jam Band

            Hahahahahaha. That is all I have to say.

          • Me

            What a joke. Please turn in your Cubs fan card and move along to a new team.

            • MichiganGoat

              I hope everyone does realize that Timmy is simply baiting everyone.

              • DarthHater

                And he’s good at it. You might even say he’s a master.

                • Die hard

                  Careful — approaching the do not cross porn line— you know better than that

                  • TWC

                    Hey, Die hard, I think the word that’s giving you apoplexy is “masturbate”. As in, your frequent inane posting on this site is considered by most a form of ego masturbation.

              • Timmy

                Baiting that we should try as a team to improve morale, lineup support, and spend revenues for their purpose? See it how you will. I’m not saying the minor leagues haven’t improved. I’m saying the major league team has gotten worse and is in its worst shape yet with no chance to improve under the current plan.

                • TWC

                  Didn’t you storm out of here yesterday, you lying coward?

                  • Internet Random

                    Turns out he was just kidding.

                    • TWC

                      ::jaw drops::

                    • X the Cubs Fan

                      I just realized something “Timmy” = “Die Hard” or maybe they are just troll brothers but either way, MINDBLOWN!

                  • Timmy

                    don’t be such a negative nelly

                    • MichiganGoat

                      And the baiting continues… embrace it you can bait better than this. You can be Better.

                • Cyranojoe

                  No, he’s right. I mean, our prospects are rated, what, just in the top five of baseball, when they could be back near 15 or 20 like they were two years ago? Clearly there’s no hope with this plan. IMPOSSIBRUH.

                  Dude, with your utter disdain for logic, you’re only driving us to agree with the FO more, rather than to consider in any way what flaws may actually exist in their strategies and moves. Please think before you post. I mean, I know you won’t, but it feels good telling you to.

                  LOL.

          • BT

            Timmy, what do you think is the normal time frame for a rebuild to start showing results in a team’s win/loss record?

            • DarthHater

              [img]http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2814/9160539491_13f37f9c16_o.jpg[/img]

              • YourResidentJag

                Veruca Salt!

            • Kyle

              That depends on the team and the approach. It can be done very quickly. It can take a decade or more.

            • Timmy

              This is an easy one. For Boston it was literally one year much to Theo’s chagrin I’m sure. For other teams I’d say with a potential 160-180 payroll it’s 3 years. We’re in year 2, so if by the end of next year we haven’t made reasonable improvements then something’s wrong somewhere. I think it’s ownership, we can disagree about the source. But 3 years for a big market team to be respectable is pretty fair—–unless owners are restricting improvement on purpose for other reasons.

              • Timmy

                And I’m not saying 3 years to winning it all. I’m saying if in 3 years you can’t assemble a reasonable team with our minor league system, the free agent market, and current roster then it’s because you don’t want to. Is it possible that some tactics will fail? Of course. The question becomes why not make the 4th richest team competitive with the 3rd highest ticket prices?

                • BT

                  Then it’s pretty obvious you are contradicting yourself. You say 3 years is a reasonable amount of time to wait and see if a rebuild has started to show success. Of course, it hasn’t been 3 years, yet you have already declared this rebuild a failure.

                  This is totally disregarding your comments about big market teams which is entirely based on a financial platform that simply doesn’t exist anymore. Having a ton of money doesn’t matter if impact free agents don’t make it to the market. Having a ton of money doesn’t matter if you are completely handcuffed from signing amateur talent solely by virtue of having the deep pockets to draft tough signs.

                  Being a big market team gives much less advantage over small market teams when it comes to rebuilding (at least in comparison to 4 years ago), and I don’t think anyone has any idea what a reasonable amount of time is now with the new rule changes.

    • Rich H

      Yep that is why they traded Feldman for a couple guys that would be FA’s then.

    • Jimmy James

      Actually methinks it means garza has outpriced his value to the cubs…..he’s very good when healthy but has had nagging issues in Chicago, I would love to extend for reasonable money but accept that probably won’t happen

  • Crockett

    Brett –

    I am politely asking you to invoke the “for the betterment of us all” clause and block Die Hard’s IP address.

    • Timmy

      stop trying to censor everyone. what are you vladirmir putin?

      • Crockett

        Just you and Die Hard.

        • DarthHater

          Hey, I want to be censored, too! :-P

          • Die hard

            After awhile it tickles

          • Putin

            Your memes are too valuable to the site…you have to stay.

            • DarthHater

              [img]http://ct.fra.bz/ol/fz/sw/i54/2/12/1/frabz-If-this-guy-stood-on-top-of-a-cracker-Would-he-be-Putin-on-a-Rit-971a79.jpg[/img]

              • YourResidentJag

                Nice.

        • Jimmy James

          Block one I you may get them both lol

      • X the Cubs Fan

        You guys are idiots I hope you never cheer for the Cubs again, since everyone in the organization sucks. LETS JUST FIRE THE WHOLE TEAM!!!

        • Timmy

          that seems to be the logic these days. every time i’m like let’s move from promoting ownership and general management to supporting coaches and players people start vomiting on their shoes. this is a generation who sees players as objects to be traded and has no loyalties.

          • Rich H

            You were the one saying management and failed and trade everyone. So I guess that means you have no loyalty either?

    • Carew

      Agreed

    • DarthHater

      You know, it is, in fact, possible for you to just not read Die hard’s posts, if they bug you that much.

      • Crockett

        QUIT USING LOGIC.

        Isn’t the new American way just to get rid of things we don’t like?

        • DarthHater

          [stealth drone approaching...]

          • Brandon

            Ha!!!

        • Timmy

          sorry dude but you can’t root for a team without rooting for its players. they’re humans not fantasy statistics.

          • DarthHater

            Crockett was talking about getting rid of you and Die hard, not the players. I suspect you are human, but Die hard is almost certainly some kind of diabolical spam program.

          • Cyranojoe

            Meh. I stopped being a 49ers fan after Montana went to KC. I basically stopped being a Bulls fan after MJ retired. I never stopped being a Cubs fan or a Bears fan, and I most certainly did not always like the players.

            • Die hard

              Ditto– you are on the rite site

    • Die hard

      You can’t handle the truth but you need me on this site because nobody else is willing to risk his life for BN — Jack Nicholson knows where you blog

      • Rebuilding

        If it came down to it I would help defend Brett’s house if Ricketts rolled in the tanks and tried to shut him down

        • Die hard

          Would you defend us too?

        • TWC

          I’d probably be willing to make a trip to Columbus for that, especially if it meant I got to see tanks. Tanks are cool. At least, they were on my childhood trips to Cantigny.

          • X the Cubs Fan

            Tanks were cool. (aka TWC)

            • TWC

              Heh.

        • Internet Random

          “If it came down to it I would help defend Brett’s house if Ricketts rolled in the tanks and tried to shut him down”

          I would not. I would, however, be willing to write some strongly-worded letters.

      • DarthHater

        You have a greater responsibility than we could possibly fathom. ;-)

  • http://It'searly Mike F

    The Toronto trade sounds about right. You get a young mlb starter and a pretty good prospect in Nolan. Garza is a good pitcher. But as I see that, they are getting more than they gave up in Archer and the junk they traded. I would be very satisfied with that deal, given they won’t extend him and his elbow.

    • Crockett

      Which Toronto deal?

    • Serious Cubs Fan

      I would be pretty disappointed with that Toronto trade scenario for Garza. Drabek=Often injured/reclamation project, Nolan is a solid top ten prospect but doesn’t have great stuff. Nolan is having a nice year but he is definitely nothing that wows you. So that 3rd prospect in the deal would have to be pretty good.

  • http://It'searly Mike F

    Drabek, Nolan and a third prospect

    • Crockett

      Interesting. Not sure you trade Garza for a lotto ticket (Drabek) after just doing that with Feldman.

  • AD

    MLB Trade Rumors says that the Cubs asked for Jonathan Schoop and Eduardo Rodriguez from the Orioles in exchange for Garza. Seems like pretty good value.

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