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respect wrigleyToday, the Landmarks Commission will pass upon – and is expected to approve – the Chicago Cubs’ plans to add two outfield signs at Wrigley Field as part of the renovation project. The two signs, a large JumboTron in left field and a static see-through sign in right field, will help generate additional revenue for the organization, including some of the funds that will ultimately pay for the renovation, itself.

But the Cubs aren’t getting all that they wanted, once again. According to the Sun-Times, the Cubs have agreed to compromise (once again), and reduce their requested signage sizes from 6,000 and 1,000 square feet to 4,500 and 650 square feet. Those are, essentially, the sizes Alderman Tom Tunney had wanted all along (if there were going to be signs at all, that is).

As I’ve said before, I doubt the Cubs actually thought they’d get a 6,000 square foot JumboTron in left field, and instead employed an “overask” strategy to ensure they got what they did want. Was 4,500 square feet their target? Who knows. Hopefully they’re satisfied by this compromise and are, indeed, getting signage that will generate significant revenue going forward.

In the end, a negotiated agreement among all sides – with Tunney’s support – is the best thing for the process going forward. The Landmarks Commission will sign off today, and then it’s on to the next steps in the legislative process (which are expected to be less contentious, but, hey, you never know).

UPDATE: A report from Greg Hinz at Crain’s has a very different take on things. Although he says the Commission is expected to approve the outfield signs today, Hinz hears that Tunney refused the 4,500/650 compromise, which was pushed on him by the Mayor. If true, the Cubs clearly have the Mayor solidly on their side (which is good), but do not have Tunney on board with the signage plan – or maybe much else. I now wonder what the rhetoric is going to look like today. In any event, Hinz’s report makes it sound like the Commission is going to approve the Cubs’ original request for 6,000/1,000 square foot signs. I’m not sure who’s right here, because those are obviously two strongly opposing reports.

  • KarenP

    Tunney is turning out to be a real tool. I wonder how much the rooftop owners association has promised him in campaign funds… >:O

    • MichiganGoat

      Turning out??? Karen, he’s already been a tool… now he is progressing into MechaTool

    • ETS

      I believe they are donating all kinds of money to his charity. On the surface it all sounds shady.

      • MichiganGoat

        by shady you mean Chicago politics right

        • Andrew

          +1

      • JB88

        I hope they are donating all sorts of money to a candidate to run against him …

        • JulioZuleta

          Theo Epstein for Lakeview Alderman.

  • MichiganGoat

    Can someone give me a ballpark with a comparable sign of 4500 sq/ft? I’m sure we will be seeing an artist rending very soon.

    • Drew

      List of Video Screens around the world.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_video_screens

      For MLB comparison:
      Comerica Park: 6,096 Sq. Feet
      Yankee Stadium: 5,959 Sq. Feet
      Miller Park: 5,940 Sq. Feet
      Turner Field: 5,600 Sq. Feet
      . . .Many others . . .
      Nationals Park: 4,747 Sq. Feet
      Fenway Park: 3,800 Sq. Feet
      Citi-Field: 3,600 Sq. Feet

      (Cowboys Stadium: 11,520 Sq. Feet)

      • Patrick W.

        You left out the largest in MLB, Safeco Field at 11,400 sq. ft.

  • Jim L

    He’s always been a tool. I wonder if the full City Council will put their own little touches in the final approval, like they did with the extra night games. Something like all advertising must be approved btu a special panel.

    • http://www.bleachernation.com Brett

      Wouldn’t surprise me – limitations that don’t actually limit, but create more red tape.

      At this point, I’m more worried about the plaza and the hotel getting gummed up significantly. Even as a fan, I’m genuinely excited about those.

      • Timmy

        actually, what if they were to build the jumbotron on one of the rooftops? it would maintain park integrity and we’d still have a jumbo. i love my idea!

        • JB88

          You are a rooftop owner, aren’t you?

          • Timmy

            on the contrary it’d get rid of their business but also serve the field

            • JB88

              No, it wouldn’t. For all the reasons that this was hashed out and dismissed when the rooftop owners proposed something similar in January.

              • MichiganGoat

                leave it alone, let him read the article posted below… hes just baiting you

          • MichiganGoat

            yeah a jumbotron on the rooftops… geez I wonder where that idea came from… oh yeah RIGHT HERE http://www.bleachernation.com/2013/01/25/obsessive-wrigley-renovation-watch-the-rooftops-have-an-offer-for-the-cubs/

            • Timmy

              i don’t see the problem here except that the new owners won’t work with the community and have a history fighting with democrats… with tactics that have received international condemnation.

              • Jim L.

                The City Council are Democrats in name only.

        • http://www.bleachernation.com Luke

          On a rooftop? Could those buildings take the weight?

          • Timmy

            i have no idea, i’m just trying to creatively think of ways for the ricketts to stop trying to destroy chicago

            • JB88

              Oh, dear lord. Such hyperbole and ignorance. Pumping $500 million into renovations of Wrigleyville, picking up a greater share of a police presence, donating millions to local charities, if this is destroying Chicago, I’d love to see how you nominate as people who are saving Chicago from the big bad Rickettses.

              • Timmy

                don’t use the charity card, you know the only charity the ricketts are going to give to are their yacht funds.

                • MichiganGoat

                  Yeah those evil Ricketts and their cursed yacht club charaties… espeically Laura she’s the worse

                  http://www.wishes.org/anniversary/Laura-Ricketts-Chicago-Cubs.cfm

                  So I guess the BN Blogathon is for Brett’s yacht club membership as well.

                  • Timmy

                    laura is alienated from her father for these very reasons, you know.

                    • MichiganGoat

                      Yeah being a co-owner is SOOOO alienating.

                  • Timmy

                    and my comments don’t reflect upon the players, coaches, fans, blog websites, or anyone else. just the top-down way that the team is being compromised by new ownership.

                    • cubzfan23

                      Dude get a life. Sad when the city has to try and deter a business man using his own money to improve his buisness.

                    • JulioZuleta

                      Remember when the sale of the team was slowed briefly because the Ricketts’s were on a lengthy mission trip in Africa? Those jerks.

            • ari gold

              Tunney is that you?

              • notcubbiewubbie

                now u know tunney’s pen name.the rickett’s should all burn in hell for destroying wrigley field.too bad tom is such a wrigley field fan;would have loved to see the wrigleyville blood suckers get it stuck to them.that neighborhood is all about sucking money out of the fan’s pockets.

            • Jim L.

              The Mayor, current and past, and Aldermen have done a far better job of destroying the City of Chicago than any private business owner, who’s business brings in a TON of revenue to the city, ever could.

        • scorecardpaul

          so timmy, now you think that you are the person who came up with the idea of putting it on a rooftop??

          • Timmy

            hey i’m an insightful dude yo

            • Coop

              “hey I’m an inciteful dude, yo”

              There, fixed your spelling. You’re welcome.

      • MichiganGoat

        Agree the plaza is something the Alderman will be all over trying to slow down since it will directly take foot traffic away from local bars/restaurants and **GASP** provide revenue for the Cubs- the reason why people are in Wrigleyville to begin with.

        As a parent the plaza really excites me because I expect they will have plenty of kid friendly activities and things for them to do. As much as Wrigleyville is great for the adult it offers very little for children. When I get my kids there they will likely be more impressed by whatever the plaza is doing vs. the actual ballpark (well at least until they turn twelve THEN THEY MUST APPRECIATE THE GAME)

        • Timmy

          the cubs have loads of revenue, it’s just not going into the team. we’re the 3rd or 4th most profitable team in baseball.

        • Newmanium

          I’m getting kind of sick of the idiotic notion that the Lakeview neighborhood exists merely as a result of the Cubs’s largesse. It’s an incredibly wealthy and desirable place to live, well served by public transit to the Loop, close to the lake, filled with great architectural gems, and would be incredibly vibrant without the whining and losing of a certain ballclub. No one believes the bars and clubs of Wicker Park are the result of some benevolent outside force.

          Believe it or not, the people living there have a right to complain about a new hotel being planned 30 feet from their back windows. Believe it or not, Alderman Tunney is doing his goddamn job when he sticks up for THOSE OTHER business owners in his ward. The neighborhood will live with or without the club. The club ain’t drawing 35,000 for weeknight losing baseball in Rosemont or Schaumburg.

          • Drew

            Those “35,000 for weeknight losing baseball” are NOT going to the Lakeview Neighborhood if the CUBS AREN’T THERE.

            • Newmanium

              They already live, work, and dine there. This belief that the team is some kind of holy grail of economic activity for one of the most desirable places to live in a city of 3 million is borderline retarded.

              • Mr. B. Patient

                Borderline what?????
                If you choose to believe that Wrigley is NOT an economic boon for the community, you would be wrong. Yes, it would still be great community, but there would be 2 to 3 million less footsteps, which as any businessman will tell you, is not a good thing.

                • Newmanium

                  Fanbases everywhere have bought into this economic superhero myth because it gets teams new stadiums, frequently at the expense of the public. I invite you to take a walk down Milwaukee avenue in Wicker Park, and ask you how all these businesses could be thriving and rents skyrocketing with no baseball team in sight. I invite you to the row of million dollar home after million dollar home in altavista terrace just north of wrigley, and ask you if you seriously think these people live here because of a baseball team.

                  Lakeview is a desirable neighborhood, period. No one believes the concert venues are the reason. But they think cubbie blue keeps the millionaire’s playground afloat.

                  • Mr. B. Patient

                    As someone who travels down Clark street quite often, I would say it is you who believes in myths. The myth that the Cubs don’t provide huge economic stimulus to the neighborhood.

                  • Benjamin

                    Lakeview is the armpit of Chicago.

                    One of the best things that Wicker Park has going for it (and coincidently, why I live there) is that it is NOT Lakeview.

                    • JB88

                      Auburn Gresham and Washington Park beg to differ.

                    • Benjamin

                      Auburn Gresham, WP, Austin, Englewood, etc. are communities that have a lot of problems, number one of which being there are essentially no economic engines for development. If someone wanted to make a $500 million private investment in THOSE areas, do you think the alderman would bitch and whine and oppose any of it?

                      Lakeview is full of snobby suburban transplants and recent college grads, some of whom clearly feel entitled to the perks of living in a highly developed community. That is the identity of the neighborhood, and Tom Tunney is doing a good job of representing that. However he, and all the people taking his side, is ignoring the fact that the Cubs are a privately owned franchise under no obligation to exist in ANY particular neighborhood, suburb, etc. If Ricketts wants to take his economic engine elsewhere, he can and will.

                      If that’s your jam then great, live in Lakeview. But as someone who has lived in Chicago for almost my entire life, I would pretty much rather live anywhere else.

              • JB88

                You do realize that Wrigley is the No. 2 tourist destination in the state, right? Whether fans are coming to Chicago solely because of Wrigley or in conjunction with a visit to Wrigley, it is a hugely beneficial business for the city.

                This is not a parasitic company, by any stretch of the imagination.

                • Newmanium

                  We nearby residents will do just fine whether we got the number one tourist destination or not, honestly. Now, obsessed fans? They might die of shock.

                  • JoeyCollins

                    I’d love to see what your property value does with an empty ballpark and closed bars.

                    • Newmanium

                      There’s a lot of neighborhoods that have ballfields that don’t have a professional team playing on them. Those are called neighborhoods. And for some reason we have no trouble getting major music acts to play the place. Must be because of the Cubs, haha.

              • Beer Baron

                Talk about borderline retarded….if the fans all live and work in Lakeview, then what’s the issue since its just the residents of Lakeview walking through their own neighborhood, and making noise on their own streets and pissing in their own yards. Why the fuss? And apparently each Lakeview resident is attending about 30 games a year, which is truly impressive.

                Yes lakeview is a nice neighborhood, but nothing special. I live about 1 mile from Lakeview, and if not for the Cubs I wouldn’t spend a minute there because it pales compared to other neighborhoods like Lincoln Park, Lincoln Square, Roscoe Village, Andersonville, Ravenswood…and so on. The Cubs ARE the reason people come to Lakeview – period.

                • Eric

                  “The Cubs ARE the reason people come to Lakeview – period.”

                  I live in Lakeview and a statement like this is idiotic.

                  • Beer Baron

                    Really – what other reason would people from outside Lakeview come there? Other than the Cubs, the community offers nothing unique that a dozen other neighborhoods don’t also offer. Maybe a few concert venues like Metro or the Vic, but beyond that there really isn’t anything that would make people go out of their way to go to Lakeview unless they were looking for a college-type bar scene (which of course only exist because of the Cubs). I’m sure portions of Lakeview make for a nice place to live, but the point was 3 million people go there every year because of the Cubs, and dozens of businesses exist strictly because of those 3 million visitors.

                    • Newmanium

                      If you stripped out every entertainment venue, bar, restaurant, and park from the neighborhood,

                      a) the place would be pretty empty!
                      b) it would still be a safe neighborhood on the red line, a half mile from the lake with great schools.

                    • JB88

                      It’s a phenominal NEIGHBORHOOD. Upper middle class to wealthy citizenry, good shops, very good restaurants, the lake, some of the best elementary schools in the city. I love Lakeview, loved just about every minute of living there and very little of my love of that neighborhood was derived from its proximity to Wrigleyfield.

                      Wrigley is not the draw of the vast majority of people who live in that neighborhood. It just isn’t. It is what residents of Lakeview tolerate because they love the neighborhood so much. I’m a Cubs fan, have been my entire life, but my decision to live off the Southport Corridor and later in Boystown had absolutely zero to do with the Cubs and, rather, all the other wonderful aspects of that neighborhood.

                    • Eric

                      So all 3 million fans who attend Cubs games live outside of Lakeview? Obviously that is not the case. Sure, some fans and tourists would not come to Lakeview if the Cubs were not around. Some businesses in the area would certainly take a hit. However, the community is fairly vibrant when the Cubs are out of town and during the offseason.

                      To say that 3 million people would not come to Lakeview and there are no other reasons to come to the area besides going to a Cubs game is pure ignorance.

                • Jono

                  exactly. Lakeview is a shit hole. They need the Cubs more than the Cubs need them. People are just all high and mighty with their opinions and don’t have respect for others’ property.

                  • Newmanium

                    I need more folk from south of I80 to tell me how Chicago’s neighborhoods are, please. This stuff is amazing.

                    • Jono

                      ???

                    • King Jeff

                      I need more stuck up jackasses with one sided points of view to tell me how much more they know than me. Guess we’re both good for the day.

                  • Eric

                    Lakeview is a shit hole? Credibility completely lost…..

                    • Jono

                      it is a shit hole.

                    • King Jeff
                    • Newmanium

                      Yeah, it really underlines how little they know about the neighborhood and the city at large.

                      Rather than an excerpt from a concerned citizens meeting, here is some actually factual data: http://www.dnainfo.com/chicago/2012-chicago-murders/map

                    • King Jeff

                      Rather than read how life is in the area from actual citizens, read this handy graph that ignores all the muggings and burglaries in the area.

                    • Newmanium

                      Oh, I’m sorry Jeff, were you unaware that I was an actual resident in the area? Well, in that case, let me give you my anecdotal experience: it’s a goddamn nice neighborhood.

                      Which ward are you in, again?

                    • JB88

                      Jeff, I posted that article yesterday and I think you might be taking the article out of context. The call for more police was related to the crime that the Pride Parade attracts to the neighborhood, not the overall crime taking place in Lakeview.

                    • Newmanium

                      It’s also interesting that the Pride Parade drew a million people to Lakeview this year. In one weekend.

                      Yeah guys, I think this neighborhood gonna survive, K?

                    • Jono

                      Of course people who live in the area are biased and think it’s nice

                    • King Jeff

                      JB it’s getting hard to respond specifically to you. I used that article as a starting off point and read several more that highlight the growing numbers of crimes in the Lakeview area. I understood that the article was talking specifically about that, but there are several more that have highlighted a large uptick in burglaries, muggings, and other such crimes that aren’t murder in the area, that have nothing to do with the Pride Parade.

                    • Jono

                      Lakeview will survive because of the pride parade? Really? One parade a year?

                    • King Jeff
                    • Newmanium

                      @Jono people are telling me the 2.5 million fans who come to games in a YEAR are keeping the neighborhood afloat, and other than that there’s no other reason to come here. Meanwhile a million pass through in a weekend. These people have no sense of the scale of the economic forces at play in a city this size. We don’t need you. You need us.

                    • JB88

                      Jeff, agree that it is hard to keep up on the subtheme of this thread. I can’t deny that crime is up in the neighborhood. It is also hard to specifically know the cause. It doesn’t take away from the intrinsic value of Lakeview even without the Cubs.

                      I really thought with the new police station at Halsted and Addison that we’d see a drop in crime (particularly when they tore down those hellhole apartments to put in the police station), but that doesn’t seem to be the exact case. I hope that you are seeing outsiders come into the neighborhood because it has presented some easy targets, but who knows. I do know this; Tunney and his office are ill-equipped to respond quickly to this (and that is not due to a lack of resources but from pure arrogance).

                    • Jono

                      Basically, it’s time to join the 21st century. This isn’t the 1950s anymore, lots of night games and video screens have been standard for a while now. Welcome to the 21st century.

                    • Jono

                      @ newwhatever sustained crowds are so much better than one day or one weekend surges. Trying to compare the two is ridiculous. And thinking that the Cubs need the neighborhood more than the other way around is hilarious!

                  • JB88

                    Umm, no. Not even remotely close.

                    • Oswego chris

                      I understand the city fairly well…even for a hayseed…there are beautiful parts of the city, and I know that there are million dollar neighborhoods, and I know that Chicago as a city is the economic engine that drives the whole state, and allows me to make a nice living way out here(North of I-80!)…

                      Not debating any of that…and the Cubs aren’t leaving…

                      But the Cubs from the 1980s on have caused the economic boom around the ballpark in my humble opinion

                    • JB88

                      First, for the record, Chris, my comment was directed at Jono calling Lakeview a shithole.

                      Second, there is no doubt in my mind that (a) Lakeview is a better place today than in the 1980s; and (b) the Cubs have something to do with that.

                      Now, that said, the City of Chicago is much, much wealthier today than it was in the 1980s, so while Wrigleyville/Lakeview is better than it was 30 years ago and some of that has to do with the Cubs, I would actually argue that the vast majority of the change is due to: (1) a very large influx of wealthy people wanting to live in the city; and (2) the byproduct of wealthy people living in the city and wanting nicer restaurants, etc.

                      So, some of the change is causal from the Cubs and some of it is correlative.

                • JB88

                  And, for the record, I really like all of the neighborhoods you listed, but it shouldn’t detract from Lakeview, either. Which is what I think some people with an affinity for Lakeview are taking from your posts.

                  • Beer Baron

                    I get that. I’m not slamming Lakeview nor the residents who choose to live there (other than some of their opinions). Just the notion that the neighborhood would be just as well off without the Cubs. The Cubs are the single largest employer in Lakeview and also sole reason dozens of other businesses exist in the neighborhood. Like it or not, that is probably thousands of fellow Lakeview residents who would lose their jobs if the Cubs left and therefore are dependent on the team. That is kind of big thing.

                    • Eric

                      Saying there is no reason to come to Lakeview other than the Cubs and saying the neighborhood would take an economic hit if the Cubs weren’t there are two completely different things.

                    • bbmoney

                      Eric, nice. Per usual the truth is pretty much always somewhere in the middle.

                    • JB88

                      Lakeview would certainly be different if the Cubs weren’t there. I’d like to think that what would happen is that you’d have a lot less bars and more restaurants and other shops take their place. Honestly, I think Clark is mainly an eyesoar, so I don’t know that I would have as much of an issue if there was more business diversification along that street.

                    • http://www.bleachernation.com Brett

                      It sounds to me like folks are conflating “Wrigleyville” with “Lakeview.” Although the latter is the full neighborhood (and is pretty lovely all around), the former is quite a different pocket, and would die (as it currently exists) without Wrigley, because obviously.

                    • Newmanium

                      I’m sure there is a significant economic benefit to the team being in Lakeview. Obviously there would be fewer bars and no memorabilia shops without them. Clark street would probably have fewer businesses in general. But to think this place turns into a slum without them is insulting and pretty ignorant of what the economic situation of the area is right now. Whole Foods is on that corner because the lawyer who commutes to the loop and lives on that block wants one, not because there’s baseball games being played

                      Hell, there’s probably LESS crime when you don’t have 25 bro bars next to each other. Drunk bros gotta fight, bro.

                  • Cedlandrum

                    Lakeview is not a shithole, but it is like a lot of areas of the city, some very nice blocks and some that aren’t. The truth is that there are a lot of reasons to hang out in Lakeview. I spent a ton of time there when I lived in Chicago. I had friends that worked and lived there and loved it.

                    I worked in Winnetka and a lot of the younger folks from that area would live in Bucktown and Lincoln Park and some in lakeview, but they all partied and hung out in Lakeview. There are a ton of great restaurants, dog areas and bars there.

                    Now the reason for the concentration of bars and restaurants is in no small part due to Wrigley. I don’t think there is any debating that. Those that think that the value of the neighborhood isn’t dependent on the ballpark are delusional. A ton of traffic would disappear. All that said those calling it a shithole haven’t spent enough time there and/or wouldn’t like most parts of Chicago because it is very similar to many other parts of the city.

                    • JB88

                      One small nit of an otherwise very nice post, Cedlandrum: if you are talking about concentration of bars and restaurants around Wrigley, I can agree, they are directly attributable to the Cubs. But the restaurants and bars around Halsted, Broadway, and Southport, exist basically independently of the Cubs.

            • Jay

              And there’s a gaziliion suburbanites that would flock to Rosemont or Schaumburg who don’t want to deal with the congestion and lack of parking in Wrigleyville. Meanwhile, Tunney’s motives are clear—but I still fail to see how he has ANYTHING to say about anything that happens INSIDE the park. If the rooftops want to sue, that’s their biz—Tunney isn’t a rooftop owner and needs to stay out of it. The signs and Jumbotron aren’t affecting anybody’s quality of life in the neighborhood.

              • Newmanium

                Lol yes, just as much draw in Rosemont in Schaumburg. I almost wish they’d try the suburbs just for the hilarious backfire that would result. Rosemont already offered them a stadium. One wonders why an organization as focused on the bottom line didn’t take the offer and run. HMMM I WONDER

                • hansman1982

                  Here is the thing, the area around Wrigley needs the Cubs just as much as the Cubs need that area.

                  If the Cubs were to pack up and leave, it would create a black hole in it’s wake equivelant to about 3 city blocks. Would the neighborhood survive, probably but it would be some rough times.

                  If the FO Plan works, the Cubs should be competative in a similar model to the Red Sox (i.e. every year) and a stadium in the burbs would probably draw highly similar to Wrigley (you could add a couple thousand extra seats and get similar 10-year average attendance); however, the main advantage to Wrigley, is that if you get a dry spell like we have had, you are still drawing 2.5M fans, a stadium in the burbs wouldn’t do that.

                  It’s similar to the Porcello/Bauer debate yesterday. Bauer (burbs) has much more downside but also WAY more upside. Porcello (Wrigley) is a known quantity that, worst case scenario, is league average-ish.

                  If the Cubs can get most of what they want at Wrigley, it’s a no brainer to stay. If they can’t get the signage and Jumbotron, you can bet that Ricketts would be saying a helluva lot more about moving.

                  • JB88

                    Three city blocks is grossly underestimating that number, IMO.

                  • Oswego chris

                    All I know is when my Dad took me to games in the 70’s…the neighborhood around Wrigley was a dive…he took me into the Cubbie Bear and it was a seedy little hole in the wall…

                    Dallas Green, Harry Carry, 1984, and lights and boom…

                    I don’t want to disrespect people who live in Chicago and are proud of it, but it is a city of immense areas of contrast…check out HBO’s episode of Vice chronicling the city’s gangs calling it ChIraq…

                    If the Cubs left, it might still be beautiful three or four blocks away…but where Wrigley was?

                    It’s all a moot point anyway…they are not going anywhere

                    • Newmanium

                      Wow, you REALLY don’t know Chicago, like at all. I guess the big city was scary when you were a hayseed 12 year old? Did a homeless man ask you for change? Jeses Christ.

                    • hansman1982

                      Hell, I remember in the 90’s when I went to a Cubs game with my parents, we were told to go to the game and get the heck out.

                      When I was there last spring, there are a lot of the shops in buildings that look pretty shoddy and not kept up. Imagine what will happen when a million outsiders stop bringing tens of millions of dollars into the area.

                  • Newmanium

                    Here’s the thing: no, they really don’t. Literally every post I’ve made is about how much they don’t.

                    It would get somewhat quieter. More Dave Matthews Band and Pearl Jam concerts in the venue. Nearby bars would be *slightly* less fratty. That’s it. This ain’t a goddamn desirable neighborhood because CUUUBBBBEESSS

                    • hansman1982

                      Wait, I thought one of the issues presently was all the noise and congestion from music venues and night games?

                      And you honestly think that a couple more Dave Matthews concerts is going to make up for the tourism lost from Cubs fans?

                      Wow.

                    • JB88

                      I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again: If the Cubs were to leave Wrigley, the impact on the neighborhood would probably be fairly minimal. The neighborhood’s standard of living and residential real estate prices for residents would improve somewhat in the short term, but you would probably also be looking at a lot of bars and restaurants going out of sale. If you replace those bars with other merchants and restaurants, the neighborhood probably reemerges like a Wicker Park or Bucktown, or probably a little more like East Lakeview along Halsted and Broadway.

                      It wouldn’t become an Uptown hellhole, though.

                    • JoeyCollins

                      What venue? Who is going to buy and use a 100 year old wrigley? The place needs a massive renovation just to keep from falling apart as is. It would sit empty until someone bought it on the cheap just to demolish and build whatever they wanted.

                    • Oswego chris

                      Okay, sorry…all those shootings that take place every weekend don’t matter because they are two or three comfortable miles away…

                      I am sure we who don’t live there make some wrong generalizations, just as Chicagoans think if you live West of Naperville you are a farmer…

                    • JB88

                      Chris, having lived in the city for a number of years, I can tell you that 2-3 miles is a HUGE difference in the city.

                      Hell, if you live on the border of Lakeview and Uptown, you can start to see the difference in the neighborhoods as soon as you go north of Broadway and Grace you start to see a major difference. My point is that 2-3 miles could be the difference between being in an amazing neighborhood and a not-so-good neighborhood.

                    • Jim L.

                      Yes, it is a desirable neighborhood and it owes a big debt of gratitude to the Wrigley Field Experience that the Cubs/Tribune Co. started in the 1980s.

                      Sure, it will still be a desired neighborhood if the Cubs ever left, but a good portion of the bars would not be able to survive year round if the Cubs ever left the area. You just can’t dismiss 2.5 million people not spending their money in your community.

              • Newmanium

                Further, one notes that the literal, actual job of an alderman involves zoning disputes that affect different businesses and residents in his ward. Like a new friggin hotel next door to your building. That stuff gets negotiated or blocked by aldermen and neighbor groups in other wards all the time.

                • JB88

                  Well, it is a little different here seeing as how the proposed hotel is across from Wrigley and the affected buildings are within eye- and ear-shot of the building. But, outside of that, totally the same!

                  • Newmanium

                    I am talking about residential buildings on the other side of clark, who will be behind the hotel and really, really close to it. And deserve a voice negotiating on their behalf, that elected voice being Alderman Tunney.

                    • JB88

                      They deserve a voice, which they have. They don’t deserve fiat.

                • cms0101

                  Forget the residents for a moment. Tunney has also been pushing his agenda for the businesses that do rely on the Cubs for their revenue generation. Residents balking at changes in their neighborhood is clearly a different animal than leach businesses trying to dictate what their host can and can’t do to their own stadium. I understand and don’t have any fault with people that live in the area that want a say in how the neighborhood is reconfigured. Businesses that are only able to succeed with the Cubs in that location should have less of a say, in my opinion. But they’ve been given a stronger voice, in part thanks to Tunney, that they shouldn’t have. It’s not like the Cubs came into their neighborhood and set up shop. The Cubs were there way before all of these businesses. Why do they get a voice?

                  • Newmanium

                    I’d say it’s open to debate that the rooftop owners have undue influence, and here’s why:
                    the Cubs get revenue from the rooftops already, and those businesses have offered even higher percentages. Rooftop tickets are priced as part of package deals that minimize the cannibalism of actual in field tickets.

                    Cubs organization feels they will get more revenue with in-park signage. Fine. But don’t we as the public and fanbase have some say over whether we want to see the gorgeous view of the seats continuing from the field into the city at large? Wrigley is unique in that regard: integrated into the city fabric. Signage destroys that, it kills a few small businesses that you guys hate as well, for incrementally more organization money.

                    • Cubbie Blues

                      “don’t we as the public and fanbase have some say over whether we want to see the gorgeous view of the seats continuing from the field into the city at large?”

                      No, as a public you should have no say as to what a company does with it’s own property. And, gorgeous view of the seats? How is a view of seats in any regard gorgeous?

                    • Newmanium

                      City of chicago landmark commission disagrees that I, the public have no say in such historical matters. And thank god for that. :)

                    • JB88

                      No, you shouldn’t get a say. It is a private ballpark. Unless the city/state is willing to pay for the upkeep of Wrigley, you as a fan and we as the public deserve zero say in how the ballpark looks or is run during zoned business hours.

                      If you don’t want to attend Wrigley because of the modifications, that is a risk the Cubs take, but you don’t deserve any say whatsoever.

                    • Jono

                      “But don’t we as the public and fanbase have some say over whether we want to see the gorgeous view of the seats continuing from the field into the city at large?”

                      No, you don’t.

                    • Cubbie Blues

                      Beth, Beth Murphy, is that you?

                    • Jono

                      This entitlement mentality has to change.

                    • Newmanium

                      Reminder that the Cubs organization got sweet, sweet taxbreaks with that Landmark designation. Payback’s a bitch, huh?

                    • cms0101

                      When you say it kills small business, you mean the rooftops? A decade before there was a percentage deal in place with the Cubs, they were stealing product and making money because of their location next to the park. Many of them ripped down residential buildings and turned them into banquet halls with full service restaurant/bars. They chose to build their business model around a product that was not theirs. Only due to Crane Kenney’s shortsightedness were they able to sign a deal with the Cubs to ensure their survival. The Ricketts will be bound to honor that deal, but clearly the rooftops have a shelflife that expires when it ends. Eventually, the Cubs will be allowed to block their views, they will go bankrupt, and the Cubs will buy the buildings and incorporate them more seamlessly into the park. That’s the reality they face. But they chose to build their businesses around stealing someone else’s product. I don’t have sympathy for them. The souvenir shops, and local bars and restaurants receive the benefit of the traffic that the Cubs games bring them. Those businesses will continue to live on without interference because they are not stealing their product from the Cubs. I applaud those folks for taking advantage of the traffic, and I hope they continue to enjoy their success. While the rooftops are a unique feature of the neighborhood, I don’t have any sympathy for those owners, who are all incorporated businesses. They are certainly not the small mom and pop organizations you’ve painted them to be.

                  • Timmy

                    i might be missing some of the nuance of this conversation, but by entitlement do you mean a single interest of one person without a sense of history over millions of people, or millions of people’s desire to maintain a connection to a public trust that they’ve held an active interest with for their whole lives?

          • Kevin

            and the Cubs have the right to move out………………end of story….happy now?

          • Anthony

            I live in Orchard Park, NY, home of the Buffalo Bills. The city is now paying for a $130 mil renovation to Ralph Wilson Stadium instead of moving it to downtown Buffalo. They know that if they lost the Bills, many men and women would be OU of jobs. My good friend owns a sports bar. They are closed on Sundays, except during football season. That is when they do the majority of their business (as well as hockey season). He told me that if the Bills left Orchard Park, he would be losing a lot of money.
            OP would still be a great neighborhood. I would still live here. But I know a lot of people who would be out of a job. And that’s only from moving 8 home games a year… If Wrigley moved, Lakeview might still be a great place to live, but it’s going to lose a lot of revenue. Period.

  • Timmy

    this will transform the field from a day at the park with family and local fans to commercials for the walmart directly under the scoreboard. the last domino of baseball park authenticity falls.

    • JB88

      If it means the Cubs’ losing streak becomes even more likely to fall with it, I’m all for it.

    • 1060Ivy

      The same thing was said about night baseball at Wrigley back in the 1980s

      • Timmy

        this is a major cosmetic change, it’s much different than the difference between going to a game after work instead of cutting work

        • Jay

          How come nobody’ whined like this when they updated Fenway? That seemed to work out OK.

          • Timmy

            cause boston has no class

            • JB88

              You are a troll. Plain and simple. And, if I have any intestinal fortitude, this will be the last time I respond to one of your posts, because one thing I’ve learned on message boards is that you shouldn’t feed the trolls.

              • MichiganGoat

                its best to shun’em and today I made the mistake of unshunning – and we see where that went.

                • Timmy

                  whatever man you’re just a blog hipster who’s waiting to get in line for whatever new product the ricketts are promising to sell you in 6 years. in the meantime here, take this betamax and watch indiana jones and the temple of doom on your zenith.

                • Oswego chris

                  Is Timmy the son of Die Hard?

                  • Timmy

                    some of you guys are just so crazy and prone to complete outright dismissal of the obvious that hyperbole is the only useful tool to elicit a response

                    • hansman1982

                      Don’t worry, it’s you, not us.

                    • Cubbie Blues

                      So, you are saying that, in fact, Goat is an obvious “blog hipster”? Whatever that is. Is that the outright dismissal you are talking about? Because that is what Chris was responding to.

                    • MichiganGoat

                      hmm so I’m cool and hip now… neato

                    • Drew7

                      OK, Timmy, you’ve gone to far.

                      MG may be a lot of things, but “hip” is not one of them.

                  • MichiganGoat

                    nah its BetterDieHard

              • Timmy

                yeah that food and money is better provided to buying the rich more toys and being “fashionable” by rooting against your own team

        • hansman1982

          And the same thing was said about the lights in 1988.

        • Cubbie Blues

          The ivy was a huge cosmetic change in 1937 as well.

          • King Jeff

            And the bleachers, they had to destroy some sidewalk and move onto public space for that, yet here we are, neighborhood still doing fine.

  • 5412

    Hi,

    The whole thing could have been planned. Tunney’s challenge was to save face in his ward. It looks like he fought to the end and can go back to his ward and say he did the best he could.

    Many years ago I was in on a union negotiation of sorts. The union rep and company rep met at one of those restaurants over the toll road and worked out a deal. A couple days later they had the “formal” bargaining session with the company union steward and others in attendance.

    The dance took all day with obscenities being shouted at each other, people got frustrated and red in the face. When the dust cleared it was the pre agreed upon deal struck at the toll road restaurant.

    Did the same thing happen in this case? We will never know.

    Just saying….

    5412

    • MichiganGoat

      That is a possibility, now we wait to see what the next hurdle he lays out. If he continues to chain himself to everything the Cubs try to do then I’d say he’s just being the douchnozzle we suspect.

  • Michael

    Timmy…

    See lights 1988.

    /drops mic

  • curt

    that’s bullshi* I lose respect for ricketts caving to this douschenozzle Tunney , not only are we not helping you pay for something that will make us( Chicago) tons of money here’s how your going to do it and how we’re going to let you do it, grow a set and tell Tunney to kiss yr azz , this is exactly how power grubbers like Tunney get the idea that they can do whatever they want, no one has the cahunas to step up and say we already compromised and were paying for it ourselves but sure well give in even more and why donate to yr charities mr. Tunney and can we help with yr campaign. The whole renovation stinks when you have to kiss this much ass.

  • curt

    Brett how is this compromise the best thing going forward you know this wont be it, I’m sure Tunney dosent like something else it just galls md that no one will say thts enough and take a stand.

  • Timmy

    look our owners are bad dudes. and they’re using revenues to fund extremist organizations. says the *republican-owned chicago tribune. and they don’t care about the neighborhood or the team. Theo might, since his reputation is on the line…

    “Joe Ricketts accused of harassment retaliation
    By Paul Sullivan, Tribune reporter | June 22, 2011
    Two Nebraska women are suing Joe Ricketts, the founder of TD Ameritrade and the patriarch of the family that owns the Cubs, claiming he fired them from his Omaha-based charity after they complained of sexual harassment against his chief operating officer.”

    http://articles.chicagotribune.com/keyword/joe-ricketts

    • MichiganGoat

      Again do a little research before you start throwing everything we’ve already discussed back up here to prove some point

      http://www.bleachernation.com/2012/05/17/obsessive-wrigley-renovation-watch-will-joe-ricketts-pac-flap-hurt-cubs-efforts/

      This baiting is very pathetic and you know exactly what you are trying to accomplish. If you are against an owner of a company, business, establishment… stop going there and supporting it. Instead you decide to focus on all the negative reports you can find and raise a mob to support you.

      • Timmy

        maybe you’ve given up on caring about players actually on the team until your 50s, but i care how the team is run and how the city is treated. maybe you work in the ricketts mailroom and are looking for a promotion through PR work but i and almost everyone i know not on blogs all day think its bogus.

        • scorecardpaul

          I think we have found the problem. Timmy please leave this site. Nobody cares here what you think. Just stick to all of your other sites, they all need your help. I hear that team in St. Louis is looking for fans. You would fit in well on their sites.

          • Timmy

            scorecardpaul why do you hate democracy? ok i am out.

            • D.G.Lang

              Good Riddance!!!!!!

    • Cubbie Blues

      Joe doesn’t own the Cubs. Can we please stop pretending he does? Also, does every harassment charge have grounds? No, look no further than Castro this year.

  • cubchymyst

    I was hoping for a reduced size in the jumbotron because the 6000 sq ft one looked out of place in the artistic rendering. I didn’t want it reduced because of Tooney though. So I’m happy with the outcome but not the process. Think the Cubs should of been allowed to keep the 1000 sq ft see through signage though.

  • SolerPower

    I think 4500 sq ft is just exactly perfect for Wrigley. 6000 would have been over the top large. No fan actually wants to see signage all over Wrigley, but its NEEDED for revenues to be competitive. Are there actually parks with no signage that I don’t know about? I mean I certainly hope the signage is tasteful and not actually “all over the place”, but the Cubs need SOME.
    I for one am ecstatic that the renovations are going to FINALLY happen. Should have happened long ago, but better late than never. This is just absolutely fantastic for the Cubbies!
    On another note I don’t care for Tunney in the least. I do agree that he is doing his job, however he’s NOT doing his job based on the best interests of the neighborhood as a whole. It a favors for favors thing, and should be most obvious to anyone who can read.

    But common guys lets all be glad things are really looking up for our team….vast improvement to the farm system, Wrigley being upgraded for fans and players, Wrigley bringing in more revenue in the near future, sheading dead weight, 2015 isn’t that far off guys!!

  • CubsFanSaxMan

    So, the jumbotron/sign go up, Wrigley gets a facelift, and then it’s a guaranteed world series victory for the Cubs. Bring it on. A winner in another year. I can’t wait!

  • Kevin

    Who is better at negotiations, Tom or Theo? Appears both fell a little short this week.

    • hansman1982

      So do you know if the 6,000 is what they actually wanted? Was Bryant’s original demand $7M, $6.7M, $6M?

      • Kyle

        We all know that everything that happens is part of the Cubs’ master plan. They’ve got the next five years planned out to the letter.

    • bbmoney

      Who’s better at mind reading or understanding negotiating tactics? Kevin or Hansman?

      • hansman1982

        I want to say that you are thinking of something, wait, it’s coming to me, starting with a letter. That letter has significance, doesn’t it. Why don’t you tell me about it.

  • The Dude Abides

    “Those are, essentially, the sizes Alderman Tom Tunney had wanted all along”

    Sounds like he’s related to Boras.

  • Mike

    I don’t know if you can call it collusion since I don’t think anything illegal is happening..maybe just PR collusion? Obviously this whole thing was hammered out a while ago and everything that has happened since has been face saving. The Ricketts asked for way more than they wanted, bigger everything, Clark Street bridge, the Patterson hotel entrance. They asked for things that they could give to Tunney to say no to. So he could make a big show of it. The fact that Fenway has that size Jumbotron, and the Cubs asked for a 6500 square foot one tells me that they went big knowing they’d get a no and that they’d have to go down. They still get a sign bigger than Fenway’s sign. The Cubs are getting everything they want, the ballpark is expanding out in the outfield so as to not block views of the rooftops. Tunney gets to show voters that he said no to fireworks and a giant Jumbotron and that Patterson hotel entrance which never made sense in the first place. This all went according to plan and Rahm gets to preside over this huge project that will renovate a jewel of Chicago tourism and keep the Cubs there for decades and decades. It’s all very brilliant really. And if you think I’m being cynical about politics I’m not because I think it’s the only way to pacify the morons that live around Wrigley and hate that there are baseball games there 81 days a year.

  • Timmy

    blogs are unusually good at amplifying certain viewpoints, I’m learning, but im also learning that in essence there are about 4-5 people here who 1) hate lakeview and the residence of lakeview, 2) don’t care when we win as long as they’re fed information that someday they might win, 3) don’t care what the ballpark looks like, 4) think everyone is against them, 5) are not player centered but ownership centered, and 6) have never left their house and only watch games when they’re free on fox sundays 3 times a year.

    • bbmoney

      You realize you’re one of those people in category 4 right?

    • Cubbie Blues

      Weren’t you the one earlier talking about hyperbole being the only tool to elicit a response when you ignore the facts?

      • Timmy

        when i cite facts it takes time and my posts get ignored. it’s your playing field fellas, i’m playing by your rules.

        • hansman1982

          “when i cite facts it takes time”

          Damn facts, you’re right, let’s just not use them. Not that I am accusing you of using them, ever.

          • Timmy

            have it your way, cause these are the only posts you respond to

            • hansman1982

              No, I have responded to your non-hyperbolic comments as well. I much prefer good debate but I’ll point out stupid when I can. Makes me feel better about myself.

              Although, being so concerned about people responding to your comments says more about you.

              • MichiganGoat

                Just walk away Hans, he’s baiting for argument sake. When he realizes that people can disagree with him without getting him getting annoyed and have non hyperbolic responses we can return to the table. But he is more interested in the ESPN Skip Bayless Stephen A Smith concept of “debate.” You’re giving him what he wants- ATTENTION.

            • DarthHater

              [img]http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8551/8705395082_71435b7e84_o.jpg[/img]

        • Cubbie Blues

          You mean the kind of false-facts like Joe Ricketts is the owner of the Cubs that I responded to earlier? Yeah, that isn’t a fact, but I still responded to it.

          • Timmy

            just root for the players and respect the history dudes. if the team is mistreating the players then something is wrong with ownership. the end.

            • Cubbie Blues

              Listen kid, the team isn’t mistreating the players. Where did that one come from anyway? And, which history am I supposed to respect? The one that you seem to be making up on the fly? Or, is it the actual history of the club?

              • MichiganGoat

                See my comment to Hans above… walk away buddy.

    • scorecardpaul

      go away

  • King Jeff

    Conflicting reports? From Crain’s and the SunTimes? No way!

  • cubzforlife

    It’s no coincidence West Lakeview became “Wrigleyville” because of the success of the team in the 80’s. I lived atop Dad’s shitty tavern on the corner of Waveland and Halsted from 68 until college in 77. This was a crappy rundown unsafe hood with the same gang violence that the Logan Square area suffers now. Put Wrigley Field on the corner of Humboldt Blvd and Armitage and you’ll see the same transformation.

    • Mike

      It’s very similar, I think, to the area right around DePaul. In the 60s and 70s the area was not great. Certainly nowhere near what it is today. DePaul had a few buildings and basically no housing. Then the basketball team took off, they started building housing and more educational facilities, it started to turn more into a resident school than a commuter school. More students meant more businesses moving into the area-bars, restaurants, stores-to cater to these new residents. Then regular citizens started seeing the area as a desirable place to live and pretty soon property values were going up. Ancient houses were being torn down or beautifully rehabbed and pretty soon the place is what it is today. These days DePaul continues expanding…more dorms, more buildings, even talk of a hotel. There’s a grocery store right at Sheffield and Fullerton. But did the residents put up a stink about the expansion? Maybe a little but all it was was viable concerns about traffic and more people. But they didn’t hold DePaul hostage with the help of their alderman. I know that a baseball game is not the same as college students, but there is a lot of traffic around DePaul during the school year, there are drunk college kids wandering around, making noise, peeing in alleys.

  • GoCubs

    Tell Tunney what you really think. His email is tom@annsather.com

    • Newmanium

      I called his office to tell him what a good job he was doing already. Made sure to give him my address too, kinda relevant for an alderman.

  • Mike

    Ok well maybe my theory about Tunney being in on the whole thing is wrong. This guy is a real doofus.

  • johnny chess

    Baseball = Tradition Tradition = Hot Dogs
    Hot Dogs = Front Office Front Office = Progress
    Progress = Jumbotron Jumbotron = Money
    Money = Business Business = Sell Outs Sell Outs =
    Profits Profits = Greed Greed = Status Quo Status Quo = Mediocrity
    Mediocrity = Chicago Cubs Chicago Cubs = Baseball Repeat…

  • Jono

    It’s the 21st century. Lots of night games and video screens have been the standard for a while now. It’s not the 1950s anymore. This whole “if they don’t conform to us, they should move out” mentality is archaic.

    • Funn Dave

      What’s archaic is the “everybody else has jumbotrons & they’ve ‘been the standard for a while now'” mentality.

      • Jono

        progress isn’t archaic.

  • Fred Sanford

    No disrespect to anyone on thread, but if you travel and visit other parks for Wrigley comparison, its like staying at the Red Roof vs. the Peninsula. Modernization is sorely needed.

    • Cubbie Blues

      It’s a good thing they are planning on putting $300 million into it then.

  • cavemencubbie

    Even though I grew up in Chicago and loved the city, I am now a ‘hayseed’. I only visit Chicago to see a Cubs game. I would rather see one in a new park in the ‘burbs’ than put up with the traffic and congestion (read crap) of the inner city. Chicago will soon be the next Detroit, if politics keeps people from investing and reinventing in the communities. Wrigley will never be a Rodgers Center, like in downtown Toronto or a Dodger Stadium in LA.. Hell, it won’t even be as nice as the park in (gasp) hayseed St.Louis.

    • Newmanium

      Good, enjoy the game in Rosemont please. It will be just as you hoped.

      • B Robs

        As long as you and the other rooftop owners are nowhere in sight, it will be great.

        • Newmanium

          I’m completely 100% serious when I say that, although I would very much like the cubs to remain at Wrigley, if a fan wants a parking deck and quick interstate access, he wants a suburban facility. We simply have different desires for urban development.

  • B Robs

    Timmy is a master baiter. I guess it serves him well in his day job as the Alderman from Lakeview.

  • DarthHater

    Newmanium is obviously some obnoxious troll rooftop owner or some obnoxious troll in the service of rooftop owners. Not the first, won’t be the last. Ignore it and eventually it will get tired and leave.

    • B Robs

      +1, though I couldn’t resist taking a shot at him/her/it.

    • Jono

      I vote darthhater to be the bleachernation message board captain. I admit that I fell for it. We could all benfit from his/her leadership

      • MichiganGoat

        You realize you just gave a Dark Lord of the Sith
        WAY TOO MUCH POWER
        [img]http://www.photoblip.com/images/836/227f47660aaff83e3d01117ee850113c.jpg[/img]
        Force Chokes for ALL

        • Jono

          Feel the anger, mr goat. Embrace the dark side

      • DarthHater

        Join with me and together we shall overthrow the emperor Budpatine and rule all of baseball!

        • DarthHater

          And pay not attention to the talking goat – he’s a pathetic by-product of a failed Kaminoan cloning experiment gone tragically awry.

          • MichiganGoat

            yeah well them damn cloners didn’t give us enough beer to fight some stupid intergalactic civil war

        • Cubbie Blues

          It’s already begun.

          [img]http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-VmpOtPRIB3Q/TmP5lPe71eI/AAAAAAAABDk/PB0yL8DznwY/s400/stormtroopers%2Band%2Bumpires.jpg[/img]

        • Jono

          ok, but I’m not throwing Samuel L Jackson out the window

          • Cubbie Blues

            Selig isn’t empressed.

            [img]http://www.bleachernation.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/emperorselig-300×201.jpg[/img]

            • DarthHater

              The Force is against you, dude.

              • DarthHater

                And just to prove my unparalleled command of the Dark Side:

                [img]http://www.bleachernation.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/emperorselig-150×150.jpg[/img]

                • DarthHater

                  LOL . Oops. ;-D

                  • DarthHater

                    [img]http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7375/9264678112_943339c80a_o.jpg[/img]

                    • DarthHater

                      There. Balance has been restored.

  • Newmanium

    I am a Cubs fan that lives here and have a stake in the neighborhood. Proud of it.

  • Die hard

    Tunney doesn’t want legacy of renovate Wrigley when runs for Governor

  • Funn Dave

    Guess I’m the only one who doesn’t want increased revenue if it means being advertised at in an obtrusive and unavoidable manner.

    • bbmoney

      Nah. I’d rather not have it either.

      But I can handle it if it’ll help the Cubs win. Certainly there’s no direct correlation, but I can see how they were operating (at least in terms of advertising revenue) at a disadvantage to many other teams. Besides……we’re basically advertised to in unavoidable manners in every other aspect of our lives. What’s one more?

      • http://www.bleachernation.com Brett

        As a person whose entire livelihood is dependent on advertising, I obviously have no beef with being advertised at.

        That said, I’m pro-JumboTron at Wrigley because I actually want a JumboTron. I want the highlights, the replays, the video packages, the stats, the other sport updates, etc. I think it can be tastefully done. It’s 2013. I want what I want because I want it.

        I’m also one of the staunchest defenders of Wrigley Field’s special-ness. So figure that out.

        • DarthHater

          Gave up trying to figure you out after listening to a couple podcasts…

    • Jono

      I think most cubs fans just want the Cubs to have the ability to put the best team on the field as possible and are willing to tolerate ugly video screens b/c they care more about the team than the wrigley experience. We don’t like the idea of local residents hindering the team because they’re stuck in their old ways and feel a sense of entitlement over someone else’s business

      • Timmy

        a lot of people just see this differently. the cubs are not the sole property of one conservative extremist, it’s a city tradition based in the same community for over 100 years and a public trust that will be around well after the ricketts sell the team in 4 years at a profit. you have your civics messed up dude, and it leads you to lash out at your own community. it’s disturbing.

        • MichiganGoat

          i thought you left… guess you got some fresh bait

        • Jono

          Well, lots of people see it in many ways. The Cubs aren’t the sole property of the Ricketts, the tribune still own 5% of the team. They’re a tradition in the community, no doubt. I’m not sure how that contradicts anything I wrote or leads to my civics being messed up. I don’t want to see the team hindered b/c of the local residents being stubborn. Since the city won’t help fund the renovation, the Cubs need that extra revenue. It’s business. Yes, business.

        • Jono

          wait, are you suggesting that the lakeview neighborhood owns a trust that owns part of the team? Is that kind of like the way the packers are owned by Green Bay? Wow, why haven’t I heard about this?! Oh wait, I’m guessing you’re speaking to the ideology that the community feels entitled to someone else’s business. Yea, that’s probably it

          • Timmy

            how is all of our collective history suddenly one person’s business, especially with that person being not interested at all in the success of the team but the team as a profit margin?

            i’m sure some of you guys will come back at me with incredibly bitter, antisocial, and accusatory comments, but i genuinely think that thinking like this comes from another planet.

            • bbmoney

              Because he owns the team.

              What does collective history mean? Serious question there. Collectivism scares me to no end by the way.

              • Timmy

                we need to bring back jim hendry, steve stone, and $8 bleacher tickets. why in the world would i need to shop at walmart while watching a game on a jumbotron. i can do that outside of a ballpark.

                • ssckelley

                  Go to any game that has a jumbotron in the stadium, people watching the game are constantly looking up at it.

                  • Timmy

                    i agree, it distracts from the game. i’m ok with a digital scoreboard i guess, but jumbotrons are like supersized meals at mcdonalds. excessive and sickening.

                    • Patrick W.

                      Your distraction is another man’s enhancement. I’ve been to dozen of big league ballparks and my current home town ballpark has the biggest JumboTron in MLB, and I can tell you that I have yet to find the JumboTron to be distracting to me. Here’s the thing… I’m totally capable on focusing my attention on the thing that I want to focus my attention on. If during action I want to see every pitch (I generally do) I focus on the field in front of me. If between pitches/innings I want to get some more info on the game, I go and look to the places where that information can be found. It’s a neat trick, you know, just focusing your attention on the thing you want focus on. Try it. It works!

                  • King Jeff

                    So, the only games you watch are the one’s played at Wrigley? Pretty sure every other team in MLB has a video board/jumbotron.

                    • Timmy

                      the point is that i value that wrigley is without a jumbotron, the games are wonderful without a stream of advertisements, screen edits, and advertisements

                    • Patrick W.

                      Well then, here’s an alternative: Sit in the back row of the lower bowl. the upper deck will completely remove the distasteful JumboTron from your view.

                • bbmoney

                  Huh? Was that a response to anything I asked / commented on? I’ll just stop now

                  • Timmy

                    i wonder if the jumbotron will have an inset for fox news during games

                    • DarthHater

                      You know, I may or may not hate Fox News, but I keep my politics off this chat board in the interest of the entire community. Although you try to disguise it, your endless ranting is a transparent and tedious attempt to advance your own political views in this forum, where they are inappropriate and entirely unwanted.

                  • Timmy

                    this is wrong. the ricketts have made politics at the center of their “brand” in a way that no previous owner has in baseball. talking politics is central to their endeavor to transform the team into a mere commodity to fund conservative advertisements and fight the chicago community over its historical integrity.

                    • Patrick W.

                      Turn that first period into a colon and you’re on to something.

                      “this is wrong: the ricketts….”

                    • DarthHater

                      Totally beside the point. I think that everything in the f-ing world is political. But when I come here, I want a respite from hearing constant political arguments and I accept the fact that the other people who come here don’t want to listen to my politics.

                    • DarthHater

                      What they quite clearly do want is to be entertained by my witty memes. :-P

                    • Hansman1982

                      We use your memes to feel better about our intelligence.

                    • Cyranojoe

                      Such an informed troll! So knowledgeable! I shall rely on you henceforth, you trollish trolling troll of all trolls!

                      New theory: Timmy is Die hard, trying to make Die hard look WAYYY better.

                  • Timmy

                    yeah but the problems with the team are now political and due to politics. that’s the difference here and why it’s valid. if they just hired some decent players and stopped attacking the president and mayor and lakeview for a minute we could talk about ways the team might win better. but they dont even want to win and they arent trying to win so theres no discussion to be had on this topic rightnow.

                    • bbmoney

                      I can’t handle your comments anymore I asked a direct question and you spew hate and at no point even attempt o address it unless collective history is our personal desires for the cubs. Really annoying.

                    • Jono

                      i don’t see how the cubs are so political. Political in trying to get city funding? All teams do that. Political in trying to create revenue streams? The ricketts didn’t create the landmark status and the city forced their hand in denying the financial help. Political with Obama? The team wasn’t even a part of that, it was the chairman’s dad, and the dad never even ran those proposed ads.

                  • Timmy

                    i am not a troll, i am a cubs fan. by the cubs i mean the players and coaches that comprise the team on the field and compete every day. perhaps i am an anachronism to memes, ownership fans, and suburbanites who hate lakeview, but i love the cubs, the ballpark, and the tradition.

                    • MichiganGoat

                      You also like to argue and throw out ridiculous comments. You can be a “player’s fan” and still have honest great discussion on here but be prepared to be challenged.

            • DarthHater

              “i genuinely think that thinking like this comes from another planet.”

              Yes, it’s an exotic world called “Earth.” You should visit some time.

    • http://www.bleachernation.com Brett

      You’re not very Funn at all.

      • Jared

        Maybe the extra N stands for No fun?

        • Featherstone

          I was thinking it stands for Not as in FUN-NOT

          • Hansman1982

            Ya, that’s a funny joke…NOT

            Ha, the 90’s at their finest.

      • Newmanium

        Must be a rooftop owner. Everyone gets a rooftop! YOU get a rooftop! YOU! get a rooftop!

    • Cubbie Blues

      But, obtrusive and unavoidable is where the most money is at.

    • Jono

      but yes, most Cubs fans would prefer no jumbo tron if there were no other factors involved. But there are other factors involved. Everyone wants Wrigley to be renovated. But since the city won’t help fund it, the organization needs to add extra revenue sources to make up for that. That’s why they need a jumbotron. You have to accept something you don’t like to get something you want. It’s a compromise. And it all started when the city refused to help fund the renovation. If the local residents REALLY don’t want the jumbotron and extra night games, then they should be pushing the cuty to help fund the renovation so the Cubs don’t need those things

      • BluBlud

        I think I disagree with the “most Cubs fans would prefer no jumbo tron” statement. I think the majority would prefer it. Jumbotron are as much a part of arenas and stadiums as the actual venue. When you are at a game, you tend to be at a disadvatage of recieving up to minute updates from both the game you are at and other events. A Jumbotron helps eliminate that disadvantage.

        • Jono

          That could be the case. Maybe my family and friends are not an accurate sample of Cubs fandom. At least they’re pro jumbotron, right?

        • Patrick W.

          As a Cubs fan as long as I can remember (I’m 45) and as a 10-year Cubs season ticket holder I would prefer a JumboTron. I get to more games in Seattle than I do in Chicago and maybe that’s coloring my opinion, but it’s just so nice to be able to get in depth information during the game without having to pull out my phone.

  • Tommy

    If I’m Ricketts, I’m making a nice, healthy contribution to anyone who runs against Tunney for councilman in the future.

    • cms0101

      It’s probably best for the Ricketts to stay out of local political races, given the dad’s views. Once the rooftop deal is over, they’ll be bankrupted and Tunney will lose his campaign contributions from those business.

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