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Credit to Bosio?


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#1 Rated Rookie

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 07:26 AM

When a pitching staff or offense as a whole is struggling, the pitching or hitting coach tends to be the first to come under fire, and ultimately get the axe. However, unless we're talking a guy with a world class reputation such as Dave Duncan or Rudy Jaramillo(until he was Cubbed,) rarely to they get credit.

Maybe it's time to give some to Bosio. In the past two seasons since he took over, Jeff Samardzjia, Paul Maholm, Travis Wood, Scott Feldman, and Carlos Villanueva have emerge as very good starting pitchers. I don't expect Wood and Feldman to keep up their current pace, but rather than completely fall off a cliff, I could see them stabilizing as productive mid-rotation starters. Guys like that are not acquired by accident. There's a lot of scouting involved. In some cases, they'll see a pither who's nothing special, but notice something in their mechanics and delivery that's could be preventing them from being a lot more than they are. The proper coaching could be the remedy.

It's always been my belief that coaching is a lot more likely to be effective on younger players looking for answers rather than veterans who think that they have all the answers in addition to a massive contract. As a result guys like Carlos Marmol and Edwin Jackson who have struggled early on are not as likely to take his advice; even of they wanted to, when you've been doing something one way for long enough, it's no that easy to change it. For this reason, Rudy Jaramillo was not a wise choice for a roster full of veterans. Then again, maybe not playing in Arlington stadium entered into that equation as well.

To make a long story short, maybe the success of our starting pitchers early on has not been all about luck. Hopefully Kevin Gregg is also learning from him and not just a disaster that hasn't happened yet.

#2 King Jeff

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 07:42 AM

It does seem plausible that Bosio deserves a fair amount of credit for how well some of the staff has done since he's been here.  There are still a lot of issues, but the talent he has to work with may be the biggest one at this point.  So I say he's done a very good job so far. 



#3 Spriggs

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 07:58 AM

Well, my gut feeling is of disagreement with the original post.  Marmol, Feldman, Maholm, and Villanueva are all virtually the same age.  How can you say that Marmol's terrible performances over the last couple years with Bosio have nothing to do with Bosio - because he is a veteran?  Then you have to say the same thing about the successes of Feldman and Maholm (and Villanueva too).  No?

 

And to think that Bosio may have fixed Gregg is wishful thinking at best. 

 

What about Volstad?  No, I don't blame his failures on Bosio, just like I don't credit Bosio for Shark's success either. 



#4 Ron

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 08:09 AM

Certain individuals are more teachable than others. It may be pride or ability, but i think your initial point is valid and how much someone buys into a system may lead to success or failure. It is extreamly hard to change bad habbits.

#5 hansman1982

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 08:32 AM

Well, my gut feeling is of disagreement with the original post.  Marmol, Feldman, Maholm, and Villanueva are all virtually the same age.  How can you say that Marmol's terrible performances over the last couple years with Bosio have nothing to do with Bosio - because he is a veteran?  Then you have to say the same thing about the successes of Feldman and Maholm (and Villanueva too).  No?

 

And to think that Bosio may have fixed Gregg is wishful thinking at best. 

 

What about Volstad?  No, I don't blame his failures on Bosio, just like I don't credit Bosio for Shark's success either. 

 

Some of that lies with the person, I can certainly blame Bosio for not correcting Marmol's super-high BB rate, Volstad's inability to be good, the myriad of pen arms that have sucked, Garza not being 2011 Garza last year; just like I can credit him for the successes of Dempster, Samardjiza, Maholm, Wood, Villanueva, etc...

 

I also think it is too early to determine how good he truly is.  Did he just luck into good seasons by those guys?  Do the bullpen's failures more accurately reflect his ability?



#6 Rated Rookie

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 09:01 AM

Well, my gut feeling is of disagreement with the original post. Marmol, Feldman, Maholm, and Villanueva are all virtually the same age. How can you say that Marmol's terrible performances over the last couple years with Bosio have nothing to do with Bosio - because he is a veteran? Then you have to say the same thing about the successes of Feldman and Maholm (and Villanueva too). No?

And to think that Bosio may have fixed Gregg is wishful thinking at best.

What about Volstad? No, I don't blame his failures on Bosio, just like I don't credit Bosio for Shark's success either.

It's more about the level of success for Marmol. He was one of the top relievers in baseball for several years, mostly due to being, as they say, effectively wild. Especially when that slider was on point. The wildness isn't easy to coach, but the effectiveness can easily diminish, especially once opposing hitters and coaches realized that it was only in the zone like 20% of the time, and when it was, it wasn't hitable anyway so may as well keep the bat on your shoulder and hope for the best.

As for Volstad, as I said, coaching isn't going to fix everyone. If it could, we'd just pick up every one time highly regarded pitching prospect and then some (oh waitc we already do :)) and have Bosio fix them. I'm just saying that we've had some pretty good luck with low risk pitching pickups, as well as the emergence of Shark since this regime took over.

As for Gregg, I'm not holding my breath, but it would be nice for an old dog to learn new tricks.

#7 fromthemitten

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Posted 12 May 2013 - 07:21 AM

I pointed this out before but Marmol's last season when he was superb was Rothschild's last season.  I don't think he got enough credit for the work he did when he was with the team.  Also, if you're going to commend Bosio for the excellence of the starting rotation you also have to keep in mind he's also responsible for that boo boo bullpen






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