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Feldman trade from Baltimore perspective, made me feel better


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19 replies to this topic

#1 Cerambam

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 07:44 PM

http://touch.baltimo...e/p2p-76534899/

#2 Mike Taylor (no relation)

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 07:54 PM

Feldman off of the market drives the price of Garza up. The Dodgers are reassessing their price to acquire Nolasco, so you'd hope to expect that a club will want Garza before his next start.



#3 okcubsfan

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 08:14 PM

Feldman off of the market drives the price of Garza up. The Dodgers are reassessing their price to acquire Nolasco, so you'd hope to expect that a club will want Garza before his next start.

That might be the biggest part of this whole trade. It got the ball rolling. Trade for Garza now, and you'll get 5-7 more starts out of him than you would if you waited until the deadline. Also, if Cubs can get rid of him, they don't have to worry about him getting hurt.



#4 CubChymyst

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 08:54 PM

 

Feldman off of the market drives the price of Garza up. The Dodgers are reassessing their price to acquire Nolasco, so you'd hope to expect that a club will want Garza before his next start.

That might be the biggest part of this whole trade. It got the ball rolling. Trade for Garza now, and you'll get 5-7 more starts out of him than you would if you waited until the deadline. Also, if Cubs can get rid of him, they don't have to worry about him getting hurt.

 

 

Your missing the part about Arrieta being off the market as well.  It sounded like he was a target for quite a few teams as well.  

 

Comparing Feldman to the Dempster return made me feel better about it.  Dempster had a longer track record of success and having a great season and we got to AA guys with upside.  Getting 2 power arms for Feldman is a decent return.  Both have potential if their control can improve, and have shown flashes of that improved control.  The problem is getting their control to the point that it is consistent feels like a big if.  Hopefully, Bosio and Johnson can get them to their potential. 



#5 Cerambam

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 11:35 PM

Almost every review of the trade mentions that Arietta might make the orioles regret this trade, that winning now is important, and that this was a move for the present not the future (for Baltimore). All of this makes me feel like it was a trade that will help the cubs next year and beyond like essentially all cubs moves of the last 1-2 years. Also, I like taking high risk high reward guys cause one of these times it's gonna work out right?! (Volstad, Stewart, baker, vizcaino...etc)

#6 X the cubs fan

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 12:45 AM

Almost every review of the trade mentions that Arietta might make the orioles regret this trade, that winning now is important, and that this was a move for the present not the future (for Baltimore). All of this makes me feel like it was a trade that will help the cubs next year and beyond like essentially all cubs moves of the last 1-2 years. Also, I like taking high risk high reward guys cause one of these times it's gonna work out right?! (Volstad, Stewart, baker, vizcaino...etc)

I hope you aren't throwing the towel in on Vizcaino, he's a very talented prospect who will be healthy at least early enough to do spring training next year. And Volstad wasn't really high risk, I mean all we gave up was Big Z and he wasn't pitching well anymore, anyways. 



#7 rcleven

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 08:47 AM

Looking at his numbers I don't see what the excitement is. In four Major league seasons I see a power pitcher with control issues. I see Arrieta as more of a setup/closer type down the line.



#8 Cerambam

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 10:01 AM

 

Almost every review of the trade mentions that Arietta might make the orioles regret this trade, that winning now is important, and that this was a move for the present not the future (for Baltimore). All of this makes me feel like it was a trade that will help the cubs next year and beyond like essentially all cubs moves of the last 1-2 years. Also, I like taking high risk high reward guys cause one of these times it's gonna work out right?! (Volstad, Stewart, baker, vizcaino...etc)

I hope you aren't throwing the towel in on Vizcaino, he's a very talented prospect who will be healthy at least early enough to do spring training next year. And Volstad wasn't really high risk, I mean all we gave up was Big Z and he wasn't pitching well anymore, anyways. 

 

 

Im actually not ready to give up on Vizcaino, you're right. I was sort of trying to make a point and a funny. I think Vizcaino will eventually make a lasting impact on the cubs. 

 

As for high risk/reward I meant High ceiling/low floor. None of those players really very risky as none of them were high money players (the worst was Stewart or maybe Baker, I guess) but all of them seem to have (had) two routes: stardom or flame out. And I'm okay with that, is my point.

 

If ONE of these high upside guys reaches/reached their potential, then it would more than justify going after 5-6 of them. 

 

I believe Arrieta is just the next one of these guys, and it was nice to see that Baltimore wasn't TOO anxious to get rid of him. 



#9 Cerambam

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 10:04 AM

Looking at his numbers I don't see what the excitement is. In four Major league seasons I see a power pitcher with control issues. I see Arrieta as more of a setup/closer type down the line.

I felt the same way. As soon as the trade went down, i went straight to fangraphs and wasn't impressed with any of the often used indicators like ERA, K/BB%, FIP. But, scouts are scouts for a reason, and scouts like his stuff. Scouts like his stuff enough to say that though this trade may be helpful for the 2013 Orioles, they may come to regret it. Basically, if this kid figures it out, he will be lights out.



#10 calicubsfan007

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 11:16 AM

Does this mean that the Orioles are out on Garza now?



#11 Cerambam

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 01:06 PM

Does this mean that the Orioles are out on Garza now?

They were never too high on him. 



#12 Rizzo1684

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 02:24 PM

The big thing that I took away from the trade is that the cubs are trying to put together a team that could start winning as soon as next year.  I'm sure they had a lot of offers on the table for higher ranked prospects that were still 2-3 years away. 



#13 Cerambam

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 02:35 PM

The big thing that I took away from the trade is that the cubs are trying to put together a team that could start winning as soon as next year.  I'm sure they had a lot of offers on the table for higher ranked prospects that were still 2-3 years away. 

Do you mean prospects that were at once nominally rated higher than either of these pitchers? or Prospects whose ceilings and/or floors are higher? 

 

Because, Im not so sure the front office could have gotten too many (if any) offers that were better than this. I was sure hoping for more, but as it has shaken out, it seems that 1. these pitchers have some serious potential and 2. the cubs were not offered any serious prospects for Feldman. I've determined this from listening to Keith Law on the podcast, especially.



#14 wvcubsfan

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 02:52 PM

 

The big thing that I took away from the trade is that the cubs are trying to put together a team that could start winning as soon as next year.  I'm sure they had a lot of offers on the table for higher ranked prospects that were still 2-3 years away. 

Do you mean prospects that were at once nominally rated higher than either of these pitchers? or Prospects whose ceilings and/or floors are higher? 

 

Because, Im not so sure the front office could have gotten too many (if any) offers that were better than this. I was sure hoping for more, but as it has shaken out, it seems that 1. these pitchers have some serious potential and 2. the cubs were not offered any serious prospects for Feldman. I've determined this from listening to Keith Law on the podcast, especially.

 

This is where I'm at as well.  I think they got an offer they felt wouldn't be bettered and if it was not by enough to wait and take the chance of something happening to put the trade in jeopardy.



#15 Rizzo1684

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 03:16 PM

I believe if the cubs waited they could have gotten a higher rated prospect as in the top 100-200 prospect rankings, but it would have been a younger guy.  What I think happened is they wanted to move Feldman early so teams would not play Feldman vs Garza down the stretch and the cubs scouts saw something in Arietta and they saw a chance to bolster the bullpen.  I still feel if the cubs were just wanting a younger higher ranked prospect they could have gotten it but it might have cost them in Garza. I found that interesting they are taking the older prospects was my main point and if they do the same with Garza by going after a Porcello type instead of a top 100 younger player then I really will be convinced they are going to seriously start trying to win that the major league level next year.  I will gladly admit that I would of been wrong b/c I really thought the cubs would not be serious at the major league level until 2015.






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