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The "I am done with Starlin Castro" bandwagon thread...


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67 replies to this topic

#16 jh03

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Posted 19 August 2013 - 05:33 PM

Are we going to blame his year-long slump on off-the-field issues, then?

Are we going to blame it on our team being noncompetitive?

Are we going to blame it on poor work ethic?

Are we going to blame it on coaching?

Are we going to blame it on his age?

 

It's as feasible as any of the other excuses being thought of for his decline over the past two years.

No, it's really not. There's a lot of perfectly explainable reasons to believe why Starlin has been struggling. And, likely, there isn't just one answer. Implying he could have taken PED's isn't one of them. PED's don't give you bat-to-ball skills. That's what made Starlin great. You can site his timing and new approach to why his bat-to-ball skills haven't been as good, which makes sense. There could be other reasons why his bat-to-ball skills diminished too.... implying that PED's are the reason why is seriously so ill-informed it's comical. 



#17 MichiganGoat

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Posted 19 August 2013 - 05:33 PM

Are we just going to ask questions and throw something until it sticks?

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#18 MichiganGoat

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Posted 19 August 2013 - 05:36 PM

Are we going to blame his year-long slump on off-the-field issues, then?
Are we going to blame it on our team being noncompetitive?
Are we going to blame it on poor work ethic?
Are we going to blame it on coaching?
Are we going to blame it on his age?
 
It's as feasible as any of the other excuses being thought of for his decline over the past two years.

No, it's really not. There's a lot of perfectly explainable reasons to believe why Starlin has been struggling. And, likely, there isn't just one answer. Implying he could have taken PED's isn't one of them. PED's don't give you bat-to-ball skills. That's what made Starlin great. You can site his timing and new approach to why his bat-to-ball skills haven't been as good, which makes sense. There could be other reasons why his bat-to-ball skills diminished too.... implying that PED's are the reason why is seriously so ill-informed it's comical.
Agreed making PED accusations is irresponsible and what bad journalism uses to bait readers for hits... "Lets say the most polarizing questions and then ignore trying to report factual truths"

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#19 jh03

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Posted 19 August 2013 - 05:38 PM

But Goat, we can't prove any of the other explanations, so we can use PED's as an explanation too! 



#20 MichiganGoat

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Posted 19 August 2013 - 05:39 PM

And btw I'm not defending Castro there are plenty of statistical concerns to have with his performance but I will defend him if people start throwing out undocumented reasons. If you just stick to the facts there are plenty of reason to be down on Castro, so I just don't see why wild accusations need to be thrown around. Isn't BleacherNation better than this?

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#21 MichiganGoat

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Posted 19 August 2013 - 05:40 PM

But Goat, we can't prove any of the other explanations, so we can use PED's as an explanation too!

Well if you throw enough darts you might just stab someone in the eye I guess.

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#22 jh03

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Posted 19 August 2013 - 05:45 PM

And btw I'm not defending Castro there are plenty of statistical concerns to have with his performance but I will defend him if people start throwing out undocumented reasons. If you just stick to the facts there are plenty of reason to be down on Castro, so I just don't see why wild accusations need to be thrown around. Isn't BleacherNation better than this?

Oh, I agree. There's definitely reason to be nervous about what's going on with Starlin. But, I'm far from being off the bandwagon. 



#23 MichiganGoat

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Posted 19 August 2013 - 05:52 PM

I'm indifferent with Castro right now but I want to see what next year looks like before I hoping he gets traded. If a good trade comes along I'd be fine with him going but not because I have faith in Baez because the return would improve the team. Right now his value is diminished so might as well see what he can do next year.

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#24 jh03

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Posted 19 August 2013 - 05:59 PM

I pretty much agree on all accounts. I really think he'll turn it around next year though.... I just have a hunch. Take that for what it's worth haha. 



#25 fromthemitten

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Posted 19 August 2013 - 06:25 PM

 Some people have ice in their veins, others do not.

 

Maybe Castro's problem is that he DOES have ice in his veins but it keeps getting melted by the belly fire in close proximity 



#26 Mike Taylor (no relation)

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Posted 19 August 2013 - 06:28 PM

It's thrown out there because it's out there in baseball. Players have been getting away with it for so long, even though baseball claims to have the most stringent policy on testing.

 

Castro's biggest problem is Baez waiting to take his place. He should be listening to his coaches, playing hard, and contributing every day to keep him from taking his spot. If he does not turn around his <.300 OBP, <70RC+, and >15% K rate, we'll definitely be looking to trade him. That's what makes this so frustrating to me. He should be on fire to convince the FO he's worth keeping around.



#27 Luke

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Posted 19 August 2013 - 08:01 PM

It is legal to buy PED's there and players know people who know how to get them shipped once they're in the U.S.. A lot of players use them in hopes of landing a big contract one day and if they do get that contract, they stop using them and start regressing or keep using them and get caught later.

 

I'd like to see your evidence for this claim.  This is one of those things that gets bandied about as if it were something everyone knows, but every time I dig into it I have a hard time coming up with enough credible evidence to substantiate the claim.  You seem confident, though, so I'm assuming you've seen something I haven't yet.  I'd appreciate it if you'd link it for me.



#28 MichiganGoat

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Posted 19 August 2013 - 08:14 PM

It is legal to buy PED's there and players know people who know how to get them shipped once they're in the U.S.. A lot of players use them in hopes of landing a big contract one day and if they do get that contract, they stop using them and start regressing or keep using them and get caught later.

 
I'd like to see your evidence for this claim.  This is one of those things that gets bandied about as if it were something everyone knows, but every time I dig into it I have a hard time coming up with enough credible evidence to substantiate the claim.  You seem confident, though, so I'm assuming you've seen something I haven't yet.  I'd appreciate it if you'd link it for me.
Or at least tell us this is just conjuncture and your connecting dots without a straight line.

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#29 MichiganGoat

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Posted 19 August 2013 - 08:18 PM

It's thrown out there because it's out there in baseball. Players have been getting away with it for so long, even though baseball claims to have the most stringent policy on testing.

Castro's biggest problem is Baez waiting to take his place. He should be listening to his coaches, playing hard, and contributing every day to keep him from taking his spot. If he does not turn around his <.300 OBP, <70RC+, and >15% K rate, we'll definitely be looking to trade him. That's what makes this so frustrating to me. He should be on fire to convince the FO he's worth keeping around.

The second half of your arguement is valid- it's based on measurable facts but your first part is bad logic. There are murders in the world so therefore I can question if my neighbor is a murderer because he has sinister body language.

You see the difference and why the prior is dangerous to start throwing around.

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#30 Luke

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Posted 19 August 2013 - 08:36 PM

 

It's thrown out there because it's out there in baseball. Players have been getting away with it for so long, even though baseball claims to have the most stringent policy on testing.

Castro's biggest problem is Baez waiting to take his place. He should be listening to his coaches, playing hard, and contributing every day to keep him from taking his spot. If he does not turn around his <.300 OBP, <70RC+, and >15% K rate, we'll definitely be looking to trade him. That's what makes this so frustrating to me. He should be on fire to convince the FO he's worth keeping around.

The second half of your arguement is valid- it's based on measurable facts but your first part is bad logic. There are murders in the world so therefore I can question if my neighbor is a murderer because he has sinister body language.

You see the difference and why the prior is dangerous to start throwing around.

 

 

I'd disagree that the second half is based on measurable facts.  

 

"He should be listening to his coaches, playing hard"

 

Who says he isn't?  Granted, the results have not been there, but that doesn't mean he's ignoring the coaching staff and goofing off.  

 

Just because he is struggling does not mean he isn't trying.

 

I don't really see why Castro should be concerned by Baez, either.  The only guy Starlin Castro needs to worry about is Starlin Castro.  






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