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Ideal trade partner for Garza


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#1 DaneHuseman

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 10:14 AM

I've been thinking about all the trades for Garza that were discussed during the offseason, and I am kinda glad we didn't pull the trigger on any of them. The Turner, Castellanos trade is looking like Castellanos would have been the real centerpiece based on his play so far this year, but it doesn't help our pitching because Turner has been less than stellar. Castellanos might end up a top 20 prospect in all of baseball by season's end. The Jays pitchers are pretty consistent, but I'm not sure what we would have got from them.

Based on the team's that are looking to acquire a front end starter now, who would your ideal (yet realistic) trade partner and what package would you want to get back. For me, I like what Boston has to offer with Barnes, Middlebrooks, Ranaudo, but I don't know if Middlebrooks is touchable right now with how well he has played at the big league level. I am curious to see what some of you guys and ladies think would be a realistic return for someone who has pitched like a true ace so far this season.

#2 Brett

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 11:45 AM

(moving to trade rumors/ideas forum)

#3 Cubs Dude

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 12:15 PM

I'd be shocked if Boston would move Middlebrooks at this point. They are also being cheap as hell and I don't think they would want to take on Garza's salary this year. Although, I guess the Cubs could pay it, like they are doing in all the other deals. It's tough to say what other teams value Garza at. He is getting expensive and it sounds like he is going to want a ridiculous amount of money to extend and a no trade clause. So would other teams give up a bunch of top prospects for a year and a half of Garza? Not sure...

#4 Luke

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 01:00 PM

I think the Nationals aren't a bad fit. They have the problem (so to speak) of having Strasburg on a hard pitch count and being leading their division (with the second highest run differential in the division). They could make the playoffs this year if their pitching stays strong, but it can't because Strasburg is going to move to the bullpen or the bench at some point.

Enter Matt Garza. Suddenly Washington is not only set for a playoff run this season, they have a foundation for a devastating rotation for the next four or five seasons (if they can extend Garza).

Best of all, for the Nationals, that's a price they can afford. Even after dealing one ace-potential pitching prospect, they'd still have at least two more developing in the system. The National's farm system is probably the best in baseball right now ; they can easily swing a major deal like this without mortgaging their future.

If Washington would do the trade, I'd ask for A.J. Cole (RHP, future ace potential), Sammy Solis (LHP, mid rotation starter potential), and Brian Goodwin (OF, somewhat raw but projects to have above average power and to hit for enough of an average to hit in the upper part of the lineup).

#5 Cubs Dude

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 01:27 PM

Luke, that is a very interesting thought. The can't pitch Strasburg come late August/September, and they have been so bad in recent years. With the chance to make the playoffs you would think they may be desperate enough to make a push for Garza. hmmm...

#6 DaneHuseman

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 02:45 PM

Didn't the Nats give up A.J. Cole in the Gio Gonzalez deal?

#7 Luke

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 02:58 PM

Didn't the Nats give up A.J. Cole in the Gio Gonzalez deal?


I think you're right. That trade had completely slipped my mind.

They may not be as willing to deal as I thought.

#8 Dumpgobbler

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 08:18 PM

Aight.. This will be a long one but stick woth me.

You can delete teams that are rebuilding or out of contention.

AL - Chicago, Minnesota, Seattle and Oakland can all be ruled out, presumably.
NL - New York, Pittsburgh, Houston, Colorado and San Diego

You can also delete these teams for rivalry / pitching heavy reasons.

AL- Tampa Bay , Cleveland (Terrible farm system)
NL- Milwaukee, St. Louis, Philadelphia, Atlanta, San Francisco,

So that leaves us with these teams as potential trade partners.

AL - Toronto, Boston, New York, Baltimore, Detroit, Los Angeles, Texas
NL - Washington, Cincinnati, Los Angeles and Arizona

Now lets take a look at each destination

Toronto - Probably my top choice for a trading partner for Garza. They could even pursue Garza / LaHair or Dempster / LaHair or just Dempster or LaHair. But for the sake of the thread lets just do Garza. Let me state however, that I dont believe Toronto will be an actual player for Garza. Alex Anthroplous (sp) is extremely frugal with prospects. But maybe that changes if he thinks he can sniff a AL east crown / wildcard. Toronto probably has the best farm system in the majors right now, and all they young pitchers they have are throwing awesome for the most part. Getting top arms back is essential, and the jays have them. The jays are unique in that they probably have a number of combinations of prospects that would satisfy the Cubs.

I'd ask for one of any of these guys - Drabek, Hutchison, or McGuire
One of this group - Syndergaard, Nicolini or Norris
One of this group - Gose, Marisnick or D'Arnauld

So a package like this is what I'd want - Garza for McGuire, Syndergaard and Marisnick. Or Garza for Drabek, Nicolini and D'Arnauld. You get the point.

Summery: This would be a pitching heavy deal that would help us tremedously. Also we'd get a solid position prospect as well. As I've said before, this would be our best trade partner IMHO.


Boston - Depending on how Boston fares later on this may or may not be plausable. Boston has a lot of depth but doesnt quite have the quality if other top farm systems. We could still make out fine with Boston if we could get the right prospects.

I'd do this deal: Garza for Matt Barnes, Garin Cecchini, Byrce Brentz and Anthony Ranaudo.

Summer: Quanity or quality on this package. I like Barnes a good bit. He will be a good ML pitcher. The other 3 are good prospects as well. Overall a decent package.


New York - If you like that Incarcerated Bob fellow, you may already think Garza to the Yanks is almost done. I'll reserve judgement. I hate the Yankees in terms of potential suitor for Garza. Yankees prospects, IMHO, are vastly overrated. But I'll put together a package of prospects I'd ask for from them just the same.

This deal. Garza and Camp for Gary Sanchez, Manny Banuelos, Mason Williams and Brett Marshall

Summery: Decent package but will probably be my least favorite of them all. Banuelos still could be an effective starter, and a lefty to boot. Sanchez and Williams have a lot of upside as younger guys, and Marshall would be a solid throw in.

Baltimore - I really doubt Baltimore woudl throw its hat into the Garza frenzy but stranger things have happened. I say that because i really doubt how good they are. But nonetheless heres what I'd ask for.

Garza, Marmol + cash for Manny Machado, Robert Bundy and Parker Bridgwell.

Summer: Doubt this happens, but O's would have to involve Machado to get this done IMHO. Highly unlikely but Machado is awesome, and Bundy projects as a 3/4 starter, and Bridgwell could turn into something.

Detroit - Another likely spot for Garza. A lot of speculation that Garza was on his way there in the offseason. Well he didnt, and with Garza's improved performance his value has gotten even higher. SO enhanced package I ask for :)

Garza and Barney for Jacob Turner, Nick Castenellos, Andrew Oliver and Kyle Ryan

Summery: Lots of pitching here. Turner has lost a bit of shine but is still a great prospect. Castenellos looks to be a stud 3B. Oliver has upside and Ryan is a lefty that could turn into something as well. We also get rid of Barney so we can get Cardenas in there. Might look like a heavy package if your a Detroit fan, but thats what you get for not taking a lighter package when you could.

Los Angeles Pujolses - Probably not a great fit, btu who knows. Were rumored to be interested a while back IIRC. I'll put something together that doesn;t involve trout unfortunately.

Garza for Garrett Richards, Jean Segura, Kaleb Cowart and Nick Maronde.

Summery: Nevermind, I dislike this package more then the Yanks.

Texas - Another interesting fit here. Profar is probably untouchable so I'll leave him out of it.

Garza for Martin Perez, Mike Olt, and Cody Buckel.

Summery: Awesome package that we'd be lucky to get. Martin Perez is a nasty Lefty thats pitching at AAA at the same age as Rizzo. Olt is destroying AA, and Buckel is very interesting. Realistic package also. Olt is blocked, And Martin is replaced by.. well... Garza! Lets make it work here.

Washington - Not ideal due to how things match up. Rendon is probably untouchable, and after him its gets a little bit thin, after the Gio trade that is. This is what I'd ask for.

Garza for Anthony Rendon, Matt Purke and Robbie Ray.

Summery: Unlikely to happen but we'd need something like this to make it work. Considering both players would have to be PTBNL. lol. I will say this though. They gave up a kings ransom for Gio, and Garza is better then Gio.

Cincinatti - Traded with them once.. Would hate to trade Garza in division but hey.. if they offer it good right? Also unlikely but the reds may get real desperate.

Garza for Daniel Corcino, Robert Stephenson, and Tony Cingrani.

Summery: I actually really like this package. Daniel Corcino and Robert Stephenson would immediately be our number 1 and 2 pitching prospects. Tony Cingrani is very interesting too.

LA Dodgers - They actually match up well as they have some pitching at the top.

Garza for Zach Lee, Chris Reed and Alfredo Silverio.

Summery: We get a couple solid arms at the top. Alfredo Silverio is an interesting late blooming player as well who could suffle into the mix. Probably wouldn't happen but who knows?

Arizona - Love to make a deal with Arizona. They have ammo too. The have 3 potential ace starters in Bauer, Skaggs and Bradley. They would probably opt for a bat before an arm, but they could look to upgrade the front of the rotation.

Garza and Vitters for Tyler Skaggs, Andrew Chafin, and Matt Davidson

Summery: Tyler Skaggs would be absolutely what this franchise needs. Chafin, also a lefty, would be a good piece as well. Davidson is killing the ball. Again, doubtful, due to the fact that Arizona would probably opt to go for a young impact bat if they dealt Skaggs, but you never know with injuries and all.

These are just ideas I came up. They don't actually mean too much, but I'd assume they would be at least a semi-decent guideline to what we might expect other teams to give us. I could very well be way off though.

#9 DaneHuseman

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 09:13 AM

Aight.. This will be a long one but stick woth me.

You can delete teams that are rebuilding or out of contention.

AL - Chicago, Minnesota, Seattle and Oakland can all be ruled out, presumably.
NL - New York, Pittsburgh, Houston, Colorado and San Diego

You can also delete these teams for rivalry / pitching heavy reasons.

AL- Tampa Bay , Cleveland (Terrible farm system)
NL- Milwaukee, St. Louis, Philadelphia, Atlanta, San Francisco,

So that leaves us with these teams as potential trade partners.

AL - Toronto, Boston, New York, Baltimore, Detroit, Los Angeles, Texas
NL - Washington, Cincinnati, Los Angeles and Arizona

Now lets take a look at each destination

Toronto - Probably my top choice for a trading partner for Garza. They could even pursue Garza / LaHair or Dempster / LaHair or just Dempster or LaHair. But for the sake of the thread lets just do Garza. Let me state however, that I dont believe Toronto will be an actual player for Garza. Alex Anthroplous (sp) is extremely frugal with prospects. But maybe that changes if he thinks he can sniff a AL east crown / wildcard. Toronto probably has the best farm system in the majors right now, and all they young pitchers they have are throwing awesome for the most part. Getting top arms back is essential, and the jays have them. The jays are unique in that they probably have a number of combinations of prospects that would satisfy the Cubs.

I'd ask for one of any of these guys - Drabek, Hutchison, or McGuire
One of this group - Syndergaard, Nicolini or Norris
One of this group - Gose, Marisnick or D'Arnauld

So a package like this is what I'd want - Garza for McGuire, Syndergaard and Marisnick. Or Garza for Drabek, Nicolini and D'Arnauld. You get the point.

Summery: This would be a pitching heavy deal that would help us tremedously. Also we'd get a solid position prospect as well. As I've said before, this would be our best trade partner IMHO.


Boston - Depending on how Boston fares later on this may or may not be plausable. Boston has a lot of depth but doesnt quite have the quality if other top farm systems. We could still make out fine with Boston if we could get the right prospects.

I'd do this deal: Garza for Matt Barnes, Garin Cecchini, Byrce Brentz and Anthony Ranaudo.

Summer: Quanity or quality on this package. I like Barnes a good bit. He will be a good ML pitcher. The other 3 are good prospects as well. Overall a decent package.


New York - If you like that Incarcerated Bob fellow, you may already think Garza to the Yanks is almost done. I'll reserve judgement. I hate the Yankees in terms of potential suitor for Garza. Yankees prospects, IMHO, are vastly overrated. But I'll put together a package of prospects I'd ask for from them just the same.

This deal. Garza and Camp for Gary Sanchez, Manny Banuelos, Mason Williams and Brett Marshall

Summery: Decent package but will probably be my least favorite of them all. Banuelos still could be an effective starter, and a lefty to boot. Sanchez and Williams have a lot of upside as younger guys, and Marshall would be a solid throw in.

Baltimore - I really doubt Baltimore woudl throw its hat into the Garza frenzy but stranger things have happened. I say that because i really doubt how good they are. But nonetheless heres what I'd ask for.

Garza, Marmol + cash for Manny Machado, Robert Bundy and Parker Bridgwell.

Summer: Doubt this happens, but O's would have to involve Machado to get this done IMHO. Highly unlikely but Machado is awesome, and Bundy projects as a 3/4 starter, and Bridgwell could turn into something.

Detroit - Another likely spot for Garza. A lot of speculation that Garza was on his way there in the offseason. Well he didnt, and with Garza's improved performance his value has gotten even higher. SO enhanced package I ask for :)

Garza and Barney for Jacob Turner, Nick Castenellos, Andrew Oliver and Kyle Ryan

Summery: Lots of pitching here. Turner has lost a bit of shine but is still a great prospect. Castenellos looks to be a stud 3B. Oliver has upside and Ryan is a lefty that could turn into something as well. We also get rid of Barney so we can get Cardenas in there. Might look like a heavy package if your a Detroit fan, but thats what you get for not taking a lighter package when you could.

Los Angeles Pujolses - Probably not a great fit, btu who knows. Were rumored to be interested a while back IIRC. I'll put something together that doesn;t involve trout unfortunately.

Garza for Garrett Richards, Jean Segura, Kaleb Cowart and Nick Maronde.

Summery: Nevermind, I dislike this package more then the Yanks.

Texas - Another interesting fit here. Profar is probably untouchable so I'll leave him out of it.

Garza for Martin Perez, Mike Olt, and Cody Buckel.

Summery: Awesome package that we'd be lucky to get. Martin Perez is a nasty Lefty thats pitching at AAA at the same age as Rizzo. Olt is destroying AA, and Buckel is very interesting. Realistic package also. Olt is blocked, And Martin is replaced by.. well... Garza! Lets make it work here.

Washington - Not ideal due to how things match up. Rendon is probably untouchable, and after him its gets a little bit thin, after the Gio trade that is. This is what I'd ask for.

Garza for Anthony Rendon, Matt Purke and Robbie Ray.

Summery: Unlikely to happen but we'd need something like this to make it work. Considering both players would have to be PTBNL. lol. I will say this though. They gave up a kings ransom for Gio, and Garza is better then Gio.

Cincinatti - Traded with them once.. Would hate to trade Garza in division but hey.. if they offer it good right? Also unlikely but the reds may get real desperate.

Garza for Daniel Corcino, Robert Stephenson, and Tony Cingrani.

Summery: I actually really like this package. Daniel Corcino and Robert Stephenson would immediately be our number 1 and 2 pitching prospects. Tony Cingrani is very interesting too.

LA Dodgers - They actually match up well as they have some pitching at the top.

Garza for Zach Lee, Chris Reed and Alfredo Silverio.

Summery: We get a couple solid arms at the top. Alfredo Silverio is an interesting late blooming player as well who could suffle into the mix. Probably wouldn't happen but who knows?

Arizona - Love to make a deal with Arizona. They have ammo too. The have 3 potential ace starters in Bauer, Skaggs and Bradley. They would probably opt for a bat before an arm, but they could look to upgrade the front of the rotation.

Garza and Vitters for Tyler Skaggs, Andrew Chafin, and Matt Davidson

Summery: Tyler Skaggs would be absolutely what this franchise needs. Chafin, also a lefty, would be a good piece as well. Davidson is killing the ball. Again, doubtful, due to the fact that Arizona would probably opt to go for a young impact bat if they dealt Skaggs, but you never know with injuries and all.

These are just ideas I came up. They don't actually mean too much, but I'd assume they would be at least a semi-decent guideline to what we might expect other teams to give us. I could very well be way off though.

Wow, very thorough! A lot of these packages look like decent returns but I'm not too familiar with all of the names so I can't pick which one I would prefer. I think I'm still leaning towards Boston if we can get Barnes and some other pieces. With their thin starting pitching and negative public perception of Josh Beckett of late, I could see them wanting to do something to address both of those problems. Theo obviously knows their system well and could find some value in names we haven't heard of.

#10 Dumpgobbler

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 09:52 AM

Thanks. Barnes is certainly a nice piece. I would imagine Theo would ask for Xander, Barnes and a third, which the sox shouldn't do. Although if you're looking for the best arm, Skaggs is the clear frontrunner. I'd literally do a dance if we got a piece like Skaggs back.

#11 JCubs79

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 02:07 PM

Thanks. Barnes is certainly a nice piece. I would imagine Theo would ask for Xander, Barnes and a third, which the sox shouldn't do. Although if you're looking for the best arm, Skaggs is the clear frontrunner. I'd literally do a dance if we got a piece like Skaggs back.


I didn't want to quote your whole thing haha. Anyway great breakdown. Personally, my top three in no particular order for a Garza trade are Boston, Detroit and Toronto. If we went with Detroit though, I think they would have to include Smyly and Castellanos. Smyly gives us a guy that makes an impact immediately. Id rather have him over Turner and I think you have to include Castellanos in any one to get Garza.

I do like the Boston and Toronto trades though.

Texas was another very intriguing option too.

#12 Dumpgobbler

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 02:21 PM


Thanks. Barnes is certainly a nice piece. I would imagine Theo would ask for Xander, Barnes and a third, which the sox shouldn't do. Although if you're looking for the best arm, Skaggs is the clear frontrunner. I'd literally do a dance if we got a piece like Skaggs back.


I didn't want to quote your whole thing haha. Anyway great breakdown. Personally, my top three in no particular order for a Garza trade are Boston, Detroit and Toronto. If we went with Detroit though, I think they would have to include Smyly and Castellanos. Smyly gives us a guy that makes an impact immediately. Id rather have him over Turner and I think you have to include Castellanos in any one to get Garza.

I do like the Boston and Toronto trades though.

Texas was another very intriguing option too.


Thanks. Unfortunately our crack st Smyly, if we even had one, has come and gone. Its funny Smyly is doing so well. When we were rumored to be close to a deal with Detroit for Turner and a lefty, I kept hoping the lefty was Smyly and not Oliver or Crosby. Those three teams could offer us some very nice packages. Maybe even better then what I suggested they might offer.

#13 fromthemitten

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 05:55 PM

Toronto: Probably the best option especially with Baltimore playing so well (might be unsustainable see last year's hot start) and Boston playing so poorly.

Boston: NO! NO! NO! WHY ARE PEOPLE SO OBSESSED WITH THIS. Yes, Beckett is a punk ass sumbitch but he's not going anywhere and they have a glut of starting pitchers after having to call up Aaron Cook to avoid him opting out of his contract. They have black holes in their lineup that they have to worry about before dealing with their rotation.

Stankees: Called up Pettite and have Freddy Garcia pitching out of the bullpen. They'll be looking for bullpen help long before they go for a starter.

Baltimore: If they're in contention in July, why not? I don't see them making a move this big until they know they're for real. They just called up Dana Eveland and his 5+ career era to be their fifth starter. This seems like a good fit if they cough up the prospects since they could use a veteran stopper.

Tigers: Smyly is pitching way better than Garza right now and the Tigers don't really have a need at SP with Fister coming off the DL and Below ready to go if Scherzer struggles. If they make a trade, it will be for 2B

LAA: They suck so much right now (which is good because the people of Orange County do not deserve a good baseball team) and I doubt they'd make a trade since they already have Weaver and Haren at the top of the rotation.

Texas: I doubt it, they already have so much invested in their rotation. They're more likely a trade partner for LaHair if the Cubs want to sell high.

Washington: SP is not a position of need. They have John Lannan, who put up a 3,70 ERA last season in the minors.

Cinci: NO FUCKING WAY. Marshall is one thing but you never trade a frontline ace like Garza in your division. NEVER.

Dodgers/D'backs: These two are intriguing. I don't think either team will make a move until at least July. The Dodgers are the more likely since Magic and crew are itching to make fans forget about the McCourt years but I like the D'backs package better

#14 Brett

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 08:16 PM

This is a good thread. I enjoy it.

#15 MichiganGoat

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Posted 28 May 2012 - 09:02 AM

Anyone else worried that Garza is quickly losing any Blockbuster Trade Mojo (copyright pending) with these last two starts. We are asking (and should only accept) for a huge return, and although I'm sure other teams don't see two bad starts as greatly impacting their evaluation, it has to be leverage they can use when negotiating. At this point I'm not expecting a trade or an extension.

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