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The Ramirez Question!?!


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12 replies to this topic

#1 Bails17

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Posted 22 September 2011 - 06:50 AM

We all know ARam is going to test the market, and the Cubs really don't have a ton of options at 3B next year IF they want to be competitive.

What will/does resigning Ramirez mean for the Cubs? Here is my take. If we do end up signing him, it will have to be at a bit of a home town discount for sure. And it will mean that we are not going to sit back and rebuild. So if we sign him, then we SHOULD go after Fielder/Wilson as well in the off season and make a run at a few other guys. Truth be told signing Fielder without a Ramirez type of sign at 3B doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.

Now to the 64 million dollar questions. If you could sign him at a discount, what would be the max years/dollars you would go to retain the ever sloth-like third basemen we have all come to loath from time to time? As much as I can't stand to watch him play...we are way better off with him for the next 2-3 years than without him. Thoughts?

#2 Brett

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Posted 22 September 2011 - 07:05 AM

In a world where we're assuming the Cubs are definitely going to re-sign Ramirez, I think the key is limiting the years. I just can't see it being worth keeping him on board for more than two years. While I'm far from convinced that Vitters/LeMahieu/etc. will be ready to take over (and equal Ramirez's production) by 2014, I think the Cubs need to put themselves in a position to be looking for that replacement sooner rather than later.

I don't see the Cubs as being hugely competitive in the near term, with or without Ramirez. So I just don't want them to lock themselves into a 36/37 year-old Ramirez in 2014/2015 when the team could actually be very good.

#3 EQ76

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Posted 22 September 2011 - 07:20 AM

2 years max.. no more than 12 mil per.. if that.. I still stick to the theory that the new GM will try to field a competitive team next year with a realistic target for 2013 for a contending roster.

ARam's bat is needed but we need an upgrade defensively.

#4 Bails17

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Posted 22 September 2011 - 07:23 AM

In a world where we're assuming the Cubs are definitely going to re-sign Ramirez, I think the key is limiting the years. I just can't see it being worth keeping him on board for more than two years. While I'm far from convinced that Vitters/LeMahieu/etc. will be ready to take over (and equal Ramirez's production) by 2014, I think the Cubs need to put themselves in a position to be looking for that replacement sooner rather than later.

I don't see the Cubs as being hugely competitive in the near term, with or without Ramirez. So I just don't want them to lock themselves into a 36/37 year-old Ramirez in 2014/2015 when the team could actually be very good.

What about a 3/30 type deal? That would certainly be a discount. I am not as convinced as you are that Vitters/LeMahieu will give us the production ARam did this year....although they very well might be in 2014. Maybe a 2/24, but I don't see him signing on for that.

#5 Bails17

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Posted 22 September 2011 - 07:25 AM

2 years max.. no more than 12 mil per.. if that.. I still stick to the theory that the new GM will try to field a competitive team next year with a realistic target for 2013 for a contending roster.

ARam's bat is needed but we need an upgrade defensively.

Who is our defensive upgrade within the organization? You can't tell me Vitters or LeMahieu is right now...time will tell.

#6 MichiganGoat

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Posted 22 September 2011 - 07:30 AM


2 years max.. no more than 12 mil per.. if that.. I still stick to the theory that the new GM will try to field a competitive team next year with a realistic target for 2013 for a contending roster.

ARam's bat is needed but we need an upgrade defensively.

Who is our defensive upgrade within the organization? You can't tell me Vitters or LeMahieu is right now...time will tell.


It won't be difficult to replace ARam defensively. LeMahieu, DeWitt, and Baker would all be more successful defensively. It's the offense that we can't replace.

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#7 Bails17

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Posted 22 September 2011 - 08:09 AM


2 years max.. no more than 12 mil per.. if that.. I still stick to the theory that the new GM will try to field a competitive team next year with a realistic target for 2013 for a contending roster.

ARam's bat is needed but we need an upgrade defensively.

Who is our defensive upgrade within the organization? You can't tell me Vitters or LeMahieu is right now...time will tell.


It won't be difficult to replace ARam defensively. LeMahieu, DeWitt, and Baker would all be more successful defensively. It's the offense that we can't replace.

I didn't say replace....I said upgrade. It will be hard to say any of those guys are going to be that much more of an upgrade right now.

#8 MichiganGoat

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Posted 22 September 2011 - 08:17 AM



2 years max.. no more than 12 mil per.. if that.. I still stick to the theory that the new GM will try to field a competitive team next year with a realistic target for 2013 for a contending roster.

ARam's bat is needed but we need an upgrade defensively.

Who is our defensive upgrade within the organization? You can't tell me Vitters or LeMahieu is right now...time will tell.


It won't be difficult to replace ARam defensively. LeMahieu, DeWitt, and Baker would all be more successful defensively. It's the offense that we can't replace.

I didn't say replace....I said upgrade. It will be hard to say any of those guys are going to be that much more of an upgrade right now.

They would be an upgrade Ramy is horrible defensively

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#9 Brett

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Posted 22 September 2011 - 09:45 AM


In a world where we're assuming the Cubs are definitely going to re-sign Ramirez, I think the key is limiting the years. I just can't see it being worth keeping him on board for more than two years. While I'm far from convinced that Vitters/LeMahieu/etc. will be ready to take over (and equal Ramirez's production) by 2014, I think the Cubs need to put themselves in a position to be looking for that replacement sooner rather than later.

I don't see the Cubs as being hugely competitive in the near term, with or without Ramirez. So I just don't want them to lock themselves into a 36/37 year-old Ramirez in 2014/2015 when the team could actually be very good.

What about a 3/30 type deal? That would certainly be a discount. I am not as convinced as you are that Vitters/LeMahieu will give us the production ARam did this year....although they very well might be in 2014. Maybe a 2/24, but I don't see him signing on for that.

Who said anything about convinced? I'm not convinced about LeMahieu or Vitters (statistically, the odds are against them, actually). But I'm convinced that someone will come along by 2014 who is better than a 36 year old Ramirez (for perhaps 1/10 of the cost).

3/30 wouldn't be the worst deal in the world, but I'd rather keep it to two years.

#10 cubmig

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Posted 23 September 2011 - 06:04 PM

I like Aramis, but it's time to develop the team without him. He had a very cold start this season and then turned it all around so that he's coming off this season with enough feathers in his cap to make him an attractive option to other teams. Also, he's slowed and his injury susceptibility is always "there".

At some point Vitters or LeMahieu or one of the vets will have to prove they can cut it at 3rd and be productive with the bat.

Lastly, Aram has pretty much said he's going to test the open market. I hope he finds the better deal he's looking for----and I hope it comes from an American League offer.

#11 Brett

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Posted 27 September 2011 - 07:34 AM

I like Aramis, but it's time to develop the team without him. He had a very cold start this season and then turned it all around so that he's coming off this season with enough feathers in his cap to make him an attractive option to other teams. Also, he's slowed and his injury susceptibility is always "there".

At some point Vitters or LeMahieu or one of the vets will have to prove they can cut it at 3rd and be productive with the bat.

Lastly, Aram has pretty much said he's going to test the open market. I hope he finds the better deal he's looking for----and I hope it comes from an American League offer.

Ding on all counts.

#12 Alex

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Posted 29 September 2011 - 11:13 AM

Rami isn't going to take a 3/30 hometown deal. Hendry is gone so he isn't inclined to want to stay for less money.

Some other team will see his numbers and give him a bigger contract.

It's time to move on without Rami.

#13 EQ76

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Posted 29 September 2011 - 01:32 PM

why is everyone so hung up on Rami getting off to a slow start as being such a huge problem? I'm not saying it's good for us, but as I recall many players were off to slow starts and the pitching staff was the biggest culprit... It wasn't Rami's fault our pitchers couldn't get their collective ERA under 7.00 to start the year. We wouldn't have been in such a deep hole if our pitching held up.

We're talking out of both sides of our mouths to an extent... we bash Rami for a slow start although by the all star break his stats were good enough for an invite. We bash Barney for the opposite, hot start cold finish..

I'd much rather have a guy start slow and then tear it up the last 4 months of the season than the other way around. Truth is, Rami & Castro were our best hitters this year.. Castro had little power and run production, Rami put together a solid year and we all want him gone?? WHO THE HELL IS GONNA KNOCK IN RUNS FOR US NEXT YEAR?????? be careful what you ask for.




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